Mozilla is unhappy because the use of browser engines other than WebKit will be restricted to the EU, forcing them to develop two different apps.

For an independent browser like Firefox, managing two browsers is not easy, so it can be forgiven that this could be seen as almost harassment.

Also, the fact that the use of browser engines other than WebKit is limited to iOS means that the use of WebKit is still forced on iPadOS, which also increases the effort for Mozilla.

Source: https://iphonewired.com/news/746093/

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[–] 173 points 2 years ago (4 children)

I'm fucking enraged man. I hope we can regulate these assholes.

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  • [–] 77 points 2 years ago (6 children)

    There is a very easy solution. Don't buy apple.

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  • [–] 114 points 2 years ago (5 children)

    That's not a solution. It's a way for you to avoid the problem. It does nothing to help the millions of people who are already deeply invested in the Apple ecosystem.

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  • [–] 38 points 2 years ago (3 children)
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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago (8 children)

    That is the solution though, always has been. Vote with your wallet.

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  • [–] 15 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

    People should fully own the computers they buy, regardless of which company they buy from.

    This means root access and a replacable primary bootloader, let alone just being able to install apps not on a curated market (what Apple calls sideloading). macOS and Windows both manage to allow root access, and so do certain Android devices (and obviously other OSs as well). Replacable primary bootloaders are more rare, though, especially in ARM devices due to efuse-based secure boot in the CPU that is impossible to turn off. There's only one phone I can think of that allows for replacing the primary bootloader (Shift 6mq).

    We shouldn't allow for artificial restrictions placed by corporations on devices they sell, because as we have seen time and time again, companies copy each others' restrictions, especially Apple. Same goes with game consoles, IoT devices, Smart TVs, etc. And before you mention the potential for piracy, DRM is an artificial restriction placed by corporations, and should also be removed from devices.

    Anything less means that you don't own the device that you paid for.

    Apple is clearly attempting to comply with the EU DMA in bad faith so that they can maintain as much control over their users and app developers as possible.

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  • [–] 17 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    And that's coming from someone who has "applelover" in their username. They fucked up big time by pissing off even their most loyal fans.

    (/j)

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    [–] 92 points 2 years ago (5 children)

    I like how just about everyone I who’s looked at this is basically like, “fuck apple”.

    There are a few fanboys, but they are way less common than usual.

    I’m hoping Apple picks up on this and reverses course.

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    [–] 51 points 2 years ago (6 children)

    My wife has an iPad and one of the things I hate the most is that you can't install adblock extensions into Firefox on it like you can on Android. Which is a thing that has made using the browser on the phone wayyyy more enjoyable.

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  • [–] 11 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    I use DNS level blocking for blocking ads on iOS devices.

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    [–] 44 points 2 years ago

    Apple always had been painfull for any third party devs. Also Vivaldi worked several years to create a browser which works in this iPhone thing, and now, after it's release, Apple admits Chromium.

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  • [–] 40 points 2 years ago (6 children)

    So hear me out. What if we took $6.9M out of the CEO bonus and dropped the Mozilla AI project?
    Maybe that would be enough to hire a maintainer or two for Firefox iOS port?
    Maybe that could work?
    I don't know, just an idea. Crazy.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Mozilla has a budget of around 200 mil for software development, so the 7 mil are probably not enough. Not defending the high pay though.

    Also, AI Integration into browsers could very well be a deciding factor for mainstream users when choosing a browser. So having some expertise around e.g. running LLMs privacy preserving on client hardware for page summarisation could pay off. Llamafile for example, is something cool coming from the Mozilla AI stuff.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

    page summarisation

    I see a future where the journalist gives the LLM two sentences and asks it to spit out a 2000 word article out of that.

    The user then asks the LLM to Tl;Dr the article down to the two core sentences.

    Same probably for business email. Jane goes "send an email to Joe saying no." The LLM goes "dear joe.. we appreciate.... your valuable conteibution.. unfortunately at this time... cannot consider... looking forward... thanks for .... whatever". Joe then clicks the "summarise" button and gets "Jane says no".

    Amazing how far we've come.

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    [–] 31 points 2 years ago

    genuinely fuck Apple for stealing khtml and driving it into the ground

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  • [–] 25 points 2 years ago (11 children)

    Why not stopping developing apps for Apple systems? Fuck them.

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  • [+] 84 points 2 years ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)
  • [–] 6 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Yeah I understand, but if Apple is fucking up with our development, not only for Firefox, for any developer that makes apps for phones... why keep following their abusive rules? When I say "stopping developing apps for Apple" I mean, any developer that dislikes the abusive rules of Apple and fees. If we abandon the system, the iOS users will need to move to Android or other systems that are more friendly for developers.

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  • [–] 19 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    The issue is that larger companies which could have an impact (Netflix, google, Meta) already have special deals in place that bypass these rules

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  • [–] 13 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

    https://newsroom.spotify.com/2024-01-26/apples-proposed-changes-reject-the-goals-of-the-dma/

    And it comes down to a fundamental question: Will the European Commission follow through with its intent to right-size Apple’s abuse of power? Or will the DMA be nice in theory, but in practice, have no substantive meaning for most developers?

    From Spotify.

    Update: https://www.theverge.com/2024/1/29/24054943/microsoft-apple-app-store-dma-rule-change-response Xbox (Microsoft)

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    [–] 22 points 2 years ago

    The fun life of an Apple customer.

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  • [–] 17 points 2 years ago (6 children)

    how do I de-apple my iPhone?

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    [–] 11 points 2 years ago

    Their lack of choice is why I'll never buy Apple products.

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  • [–] [B] 11 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    This is the best summary I could come up with:


    Apple’s new rules in the European Union mean browsers like Firefox can finally use their own engines on iOS.

    Although this may seem like a welcome change, Mozilla spokesperson Damiano DeMonte tells The Verge it’s “extremely disappointed” with the way things turned out.

    “We are still reviewing the technical details but are extremely disappointed with Apple’s proposed plan to restrict the newly-announced BrowserEngineKit to EU-specific apps,” DeMonte says.

    In iOS 17.4, Apple will no longer force browsers in the EU to use WebKit, the underlying engine that powers Safari.

    “Apple’s proposals fail to give consumers viable choices by making it as painful as possible for others to provide competitive alternatives to Safari,” DeMonte adds.

    Epic CEO Tim Sweeney called the new terms a “horror show,” while Spotify said the changes are a “farce.” Apple’s guidelines are still pending approval by the EU Commission.


    The original article contains 285 words, the summary contains 142 words. Saved 50%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago

    Apple does not care and will never care about open source other than the bits it has to care about because they're a part of Darwin, their core.

    They're a company offering a particular "experience" and open source products do not fit into that model well at all. I use apple phones because I'm partially blind and for a very long time the accessibility story on Android was a screaming nightmare (I'm told it's got better) but I have no illusions that they're anything other than a profit seeking MegaCorp with all that implies.

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  • [–] 5 points 2 years ago

    Apple, Google, Microsoft all worthy of a massive boycott.

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