cross-posted from: https://feddit.uk/post/50832775

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[–] 108 points 1 month ago (4 children)

That almost certainly has nothing to do with storage and instead is about frequency of shooting.

People that have one gun locked in safe that never gets open, aren't shooting it.

Someone doing a weekly range trip is going to bring home a bunch of lead dust regardless of how they store the gun.

We really need to get away from lead in firearms

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  • [–] 27 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)

    We also really need to normalize lead management. When I went shooting in scouts as a kid I learned all the responsible gun operation saftey stuff, but never even thought about the lead exposure till I was an adult

    I'd never even heard of de-leading products for getting yourself cleaned up after shooting until deviant ollam on YouTube talked about them in passing in a video

    (great channel by the way, it's hard to find any folks who talk about guns online that a turbo chud)

    Edit: misspelled "deviant" lol

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  • [–] 1 point 1 month ago (1 child)
  • [–] 5 points 1 month ago* (1 child)

    Sorry I misspelled deviant lol

    https://youtube.com/@deviantollam He's mostly big in the physical security world and has a lot of crossover with hacker community stuff, but regularly talks firearms. Cool dude, hes on mastodon

    If you want another cool leftwing guntuber tacticool girlfriend was rad, she doesnt do YouTube anymore but still has a whole backlog of videos and is a transfem immigrant who always had a perspective on guns I appreciated

    Deviant ollam also mentions a handful of others in his super old video on preparedness (I believe its this one https://youtu.be/6ihrGNGesfI), which if you see his videos on his friend Kara (transfem hacker friend of his currently in federal prison), if I remember right thats also the video where he gives the back story needed to follow the updates on how she's doing

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  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    Link to the specific video about de-leading?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago

    Sorry, I think he just mentioned he thought it was cool seeing some de-leading products at Shot Show

    I don't remember the video (it probably would have been one of his "best and worst of shot show" videos) and it wasn't really a guide or anything, so much as just him talking about his experience at the convention and more de-leading products getting visibility being something he thought was positive

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago

    Just wanted to add someone elsewhere in the thread mentioned jaredAF having good videos on the subject

    I'm not familiar with the channel but figured it might be worth mentioning in case you're looking for resources and didn't see it mentioned :)

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  • [–] 13 points 1 month ago (4 children)

    Copper for slugs, while more expensive has a risk level close to 0 in comparison to lead. It also has excellent ballistic properties and will expand properly with designs like hollow points

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  • [–] 15 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    Tungsten, too.

    The problem is really the cost. To go to the range and spend $30 would instead cost $150. I think the average person would buy the lead.

    I'll ask a friend of mine who worked at a range recently to see what people are spending.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    Per friend: -$35 a person $12 for the second and ammo varies wildly. They start about $20/$30 a box for 9mm 50 rounds, but most people use 1/2 boxes ler trip"

    Also, per them, tungsten is a no-no due to its armor-piercing abilities.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 month ago* (1 child)

    $20 for 50 rounds of 9mm is exceptionally high. 20-25 cents per round for target ammo is closer to reality. https://ammoseek.com/ammo/9mm-luger

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  • [–] 9 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    It's probably the cost buying from the range. Might also be regional. I'm going to keep replying to myself.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago

    It is, the ranges mark up the ammo (what business doesn't) as they sell small quantities to a captive audience who will pay. Ammoseek represents the other end of the spectrum, ppl buying wholesale in larger quantities. Not represented are the hand loaders, typically sports-oriented going through a thousand a week in practice buying components at cost.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Is tungsten a no-no to carry around loaded, or is it simply unavailable?

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  • [–] 1 point 1 month ago (1 child)

    I'm not a gun guy, but I've never heard of tungsten being used in bullets, and AFAIK it would severly damage the barrel, right?

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  • [–] 1 point 1 month ago (1 child)

    I don't know about tungsten bullets, but I have heard of tungsten shot.

    You could probably jacket a tungsten bullet in a softer metal like copper to mitigate the damage to the barrel, but I feel like that's also gonna run up against armor piercing regulations

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  • [–] 1 point 1 month ago (1 child)

    I think, from a report I did in middle school, that you have just described how armor piercing bullets function.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago

    Yeah, that's basically the gist of it, jacket a hard, dense penetrator in a softer metal so it doesn't damage the barrel

    But there's some edge cases like with m855 "green tip" 5.56 ammo which has a steel core inside a lead bullet and copper jacket, but generally isn't considered "armor piercing" even though it does penetrate armor slightly better than most other standard 5.56 rounds

    So I'm gonna hedge me bets and say there may be a case where a tungsten bullet may not be considered armor piercing but I don't know the specifics of where that line would be drawn.

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  • [–] 14 points 1 month ago

    It's actually not the projectile that causes most of the lead exposure for shooters. It's the cartridge primers, they use lead styphnate for their explosive. Copper bullets are mainly to not spread lead through the environment where it can harm wildlife, and to avoid the risk of consuming lead in shot animals.

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  • [–] -2 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Aren't expanding bullets horrible and should be illegal?

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  • [–] 4 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    No. They keep the projectile from over-penetrating the intended target.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Isn't it better to have penetration without a bunch of shards?

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  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago

    Most traditional hollowpoints aren't designed to break apart into shrapnel. They're designed to expand in a controlled manner. The FBI protocol is that it should expand after passing through four layers of cloth (denim, fleece, cotton, and something else), then penetrate between 12 and 18 inches through standardized ballistics gel.

    A non expanding bullet might get double that much penetration if it doesn't start tumbling. Projectiles designed for large, dangerous game are designed for no expansion and maximum penetration. It all depends on what the goal is.

    There's a lot of youtube where people have put that kind of stuff to the test if you want to dig. There are a few results out there that are non-intuitive. For example, a regular 38 special hollow point out of a modern revolver often doesn't get enough velocity to expand, so the cavity will fill up with cloth and over penetrate the gel even though it's substantially less powerful than a 9mm.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    Why not just get rid of firearms completely?

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  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago* (1 child)

    Yeah, this is America (Woo, ayy)

    Guns in my area (Word, my area)

    I got the strap (Ayy, ayy)

    I gotta carry 'em

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYOjWnS4cMY

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  • [–] 1 point 1 month ago (1 child)

    I’m surprised that song didn’t anger gun owners.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    In a country with more guns than people, that's like saying you're surprised people with a driver's license don't all drive F350 super duty's...

    Even worse, because when push comes to literal shove, the people with the most guns make the decisions. January 6th should have proved that if nothing else did, if they had showed up with guns they'd have accomplished their goals easily.

    Don't take it for granted that America will never need another revolution, or that a couple thousand armed people can't accomplish anything.

    Fuck man, now more than ever it's the responsibility of every good American to own and be proficient with a rifle.

    Take a fucking look around, you think trump is handing the White House to anyone in 2.5 years?

    Buy a fucking rifle while you can if you haven't already, or at least stop shit talking people who take logical precautions with our current reality.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 month ago

    Well one would take a single federal law to change. Simple majority and signed by the president. The other requires 2/3rds of congress to agree or 2/3rds of states to agree. Nearly impossible

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  • [+] 0 points 1 month ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 child)
  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    While I agree with you to an extent, I bet many people who use gun safes properly are also mindful of cleaning themselves and their clothing after shooting.

    ...

    Yeah, no one ever said they didn't. Or that any group was the same.

    My point was that storage method didn't matter.

    Any correlation is likely because someone who buys a gun and only plans to touch it "when they need it" are going to likely keep it in a safe.

    Regardless of how well you think you're cleaning yourself tho, you're being lead home from shooting. It takes a lot to actually mitigate it, and even if you think you are, you're not.

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