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submitted 1 year ago by to c/science_memes@mander.xyz
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[–] 21 points 1 year ago (4 children)

The only opinion that should matter is that of the people the artifacts belong to.

“It’s safer with us” is an excuse that’s been abused by colonizers and raiders for too long.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    The only opinion that should matter is that of the people the artifacts belong to.

    Which people? The government? So in Afghanistan it's up to the Taliban? If you don't trust that the government of a country represents the will of the people, then how do you determine what the people want?

    And, again, which people? Is a totem pole in a museum in Canada the property of the Canadian people? Or is it something that belongs to the Haida people, and it doesn't matter what other Canadians want? If it is up to the Haida, it is up to the Council of the Haida Nation, or is it up to the band the original artist belonged to?

    What about a Tatar artifact found in Donetsk? Who gets control over that? Is it the Russians since they occupy Donetsk? The Ukrainians because they used to occupy it? Do you have to study the blood of various Ukrainian people to figure out who has the most surviving Tatar DNA?

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  • [–] -1 points 1 year ago

    If you don't trust that the government of a country represents the will of the people, then how do you determine what the people want?

    You mean most governments?

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    What if some of the locals want it taken away for protection, but the government wants it destroyed?

    There's no clear 'owner' in many cases. I think it places where it's uncertain, then we should prioritize saving the artifacts over the ones that seek to destroy them.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

    You will never be able to get everyone to agree on anything and you can't hold a referendum for every artifact.

    So as far as responsibility goes, barring edge cases, it should be left upto the government to decide, as they represent the people.

    And tbh, this feels like an argument made in bad faith, because this is such a rare case. No government is going to ask for an artifact back and then destroy it. What happened in afganistan and Syria was a tragedy (they didn't ask for those artifacts back, they were already there) But that only happened because the previous governments had been destabilized by Russian and American influences. (Iraq war - Isis, Afganistan war - alqaeda)

    There's no clear 'owner' in many cases.

    Just return it to the country where it was taken from. And I don't think there are many cases where ownership is vague, most are pretty plain and clear.

    then we should prioritize saving the artifacts over the ones that seek to destroy them.

    That's not on you, that's on their original keepers. Otherwise you are propagating colonial era crimes and justifying them by arguing in bad faith.

    P.s.

    • Museums have a notorious record when it comes to maintaining artifacts (they aren't shining beacons of humanity), especially the British museum.
    • They also do less than what's needed to discourage artifact smuggling.
    • watch: https://youtu.be/eJPLiT1kCSM
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