If LLMs used very little RAM and processing power, was light weight even for Mythos or Sol, would people be as opposed? Like no data centers, no memory shortages, like it was able to run on a calculator with the same performance.

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[–] 13 points 1 day ago

The resources used are but one of the problems with the modern uses of AI. Others include:

  • Copyright and privacy. AI companies use copyrighted content and private data to train their models. Many companies have terms or user agreements that give them permission to use or sell any data on their systems. They collect data where they can, without regard for ownership, copyright or privacy.
  • Fakes. We cannot trust what we see or read. Of course fake news and misinformation has been a problem for years, but genAI has turbocharged it, and now even video is becoming unreliable. We cannot trust anything anymore. Even appreciation of real art suffers because artists get accused of using AI even when it was hand made. Although the impact on politics is the biggest threat.
  • Companies force employees to use it, even when employees don't want it and it hurts the quality of their work. AI is often used as an excuse to fire people.
  • The AI bubble dominates the economy. This cannot end well.

There are also legitimate and useful ways to use AI, and many of them could be very valuable, but that's not what the industry or society is focusing on right now.

AI would probably be more acceptable if all of these issues were addressed.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 day ago

    Yes. Cause the resource intensity isn't the main problem people have with it.

    It's the theft.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 day ago (1 child)

    Absolutely not, I hope.

    The impact on the minds and the constant push for the thing for all the wrong reasons are enough for me to keep hating it.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 day ago

    Where I think the bulk of the hate comes from is less the tech, but more the political and business elite pushing this tech.

    These people are going full mask off trying to delete those they deem the lower class, so much so they are blinded in how much they require people outside the LLMs to maintain society.

    LLMs as they are now, are basically the Golden Calf scenario all over again; it is ungrateful people build a statue to claim superiority and mock that which put them in good places.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 day ago

    It will always be resource intensive since companies are in a dick measuring contest of who can sink the most resources into it. If it was lighter they word simply do more of it

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  • [–] 4 points 1 day ago*

    I think its hated because its about building dystopia. We see the datacenters coming up now that are the core infrastructure for global high tech dystopia and people still think it's about chat bots.

    History books will wonder why people didn't stop it.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 day ago

    Slop is still slop, and if it was cheaper and less intensive in those ways it would simply be producing way more slop.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 day ago

    Would be even more. The main harm of AI comes from malicious actors being able to ruin the internet forever with practically undetectable bot spam costing cents to run. Also taking jobs in art, where automation was never possible as efficiency is not what art is valued for.

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  • [–] 117 points 2 days ago (2 children)

    LLM the technology is interesting and impressive. the way companies are shoving it into everything and trying to sell it as a replacement for employees is awful. The way the AI companies are behaving is awful.

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  • [–] 28 points 2 days ago (2 children)

    AI is great! it just needs a little work on the IP theft, the environmental impact, the dopamine addiction, the cornering of the component market, the reliability, the hidden system prompts, the non-determinism, the push to have everything in the cloud, the enshittification, the empowerment of the billionaires, the reduction in user’s cognitive abilities, the lack of real-world use cases, the reliability, the spying on humans intimate thoughts, the overblown marketing, the bubble impact on the world economy, and the reliability. Other than that, it’s just fine! Trust me, bro!

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  • [–] 1 point 1 day ago

    The same can be said about LITERALLY every technology ever made. Everything you listed is real, problems that need to be addressed, and the companies responsible for exacerbating them held accountable.

    A technologies worst implementations are not representative of its usefulness.

    Unless you want to ban the entire field of biology as well for the atrocities committed associated with it.

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  • [–] 16 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (3 children)

    This is pretty much my thoughts as well. My unsolicited rant:

    The technology is good and anyone who says it's "just autocorrect" are wrong. Having said that, I agree that LLMs are useful really for nothing more than low-risk, personal research and/or signposting to other sources. It's in no way a replacement for a human (unless your definition of what a human does is that it's just a thing that produces words at you - in which case, you're probably a middle manager - very myopic, regardless). It's also not appropriate for anything financial, professional, or confidential. Here, the first L in LLM is a hindrance. Local, small language models are more appropriate and cost-effective here.

    Anyway. I don't "use AI" like some people but over the last year I've used my access to Proton's Lumo (already included in my subscription) a handful of times and been pleased with the results. The way that I see it is that all the LLM libraries are trained almost entirely on Reddit or websites that stole their content from Reddit anyway, so use it like you would Reddit: "LGBT horror movies before 2000," "Summarize and cite criticisms of Camille Paglia," "Was Bioshock 2 well-received at launch?" All very low-stakes. Doesn't really matter. Could've been a Reddit thread, but it's likely that any response there would've been a middleman for an AI answer anyway.

    Anyway. More: Call it cope but I've been developing a theory/outlook that the internet as a thing is basically dead and that the Pandora's Box of LLM tech, which can produce a basically infinite amount of what was once the internet's currency (read: information, but really: text), has killed it. The Fediverse is utopian but I don't think anyone here really believes it will ever be anything more than a cluster of fringe communities. Having said that, I justify good LLM use (like mine, lucky that) as being the "New Game Plus" mode of the internet. Everything is already there, everything's unlocked. There is no challenge. It's kind of cheating and you're not really supposed to play the game like that. But at the same time, there is no going back to the real beginning, I just have the option of nostalgically re-creating it by going to old.reddit or postfixing before:2022 to all my Google DDG searches. Fun, and game-ish in it's own right, but also artificially limiting for no reasons beyond that.

    /rant

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  • [–] 4 points 2 days ago

    Could’ve been a Reddit thread, but it’s likely that any response there would’ve been a middleman for an AI answer anyway.

    Except a large part of the reason that people used reddit is that you tended to get decent information. The big/good answers would often be some dude who is waay to into football having a 6 post page about who the GOAT player is.

    Now, AI is basically so prolific, that a lot of what AI is being trained on...is other AI. Its slop badly reproducing slop, and the answers that AI gives you are either wrong, or are driven largely by somebody making 50 AI chatbots to swarm reddit with their opinion (or more often, to sell their product).

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  • [–] 4 points 2 days ago

    cluster of fringe communities

    I was already sold on it, you don't have to keep buttering me up on the idea.

    When everything is so searchable and indexable, obscurity is almost a feature

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  • [–] 45 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    No because dead internet theory and it literally makes humans dumber.

    Lower reading comprehension. Less able to write or even explain something.

    Lower attention.

    Lower proficiency in just about anything ai can do. Lower critical thinking.

    There is a ton of research on this.

    Ai also tells people they are always right and gives them bad advice. Sometimes fatal advice.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    I think you are jumping to conclusions. Many of these things started happening before AI. This shit has been happening far longer than the past few 2-3 years.

    Reading proficiency and critical thinking started their decline when tech was introduced in the classroom.

    Now the constant affirmation of one’s thoughts and essentially echo chamber I can’t dispute.

    Don’t get me wrong. I dislike AI and it’s proliferation into the world as much as the next person, but we can’t blame it on our societies failing schools or rather lack of true learning.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 day ago (1 child)

    I'm not saying it's all new problems.

    Yeah you make a good point. Tech in the classrooms started the decline. Not to mention covid caused higher reliance on that tech.

    And then primary schools have 1 teacher for 30 kids.

    And they no longer hold kids back. Everyone passes rather they should or shouldn't.

    When I was a kid, the social shame of being held back was a strong motivator. Not just for the kid but the parents to put in more time making sure the kid caught up.

    And then even after I finished, I heard that mandatory summer school was being used to get kids caught up.

    But idk how common that is around the country.

    But to come back to AI. There is a lot of research showing using llms literally reduces reading comprehension and critical thinking even in a short time of 1 semester.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 day ago*

    Well if that was the case tech bros would just strap 1000000 calculators together, call it mega AI and proceed to claim it is the next best thing that ever happened to humanity and billionaires would fund them. It is these opportunistic vultures that enshittify everything and make them anti-human.

    If the AI today always proceeded with the mind set of openness and locality it could still produce very useful tools for a fraction of the environmental impact it causes now but they instead, as always, have chosen thr most aggressive possible method because it can be hyped more.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 day ago (1 child)

    The main problem for me is that it's so confident in it's tone, like that idiot friend who just makes stuff up, but totally believes it. So there's no clue (like you would get with a normal person) that the thing has no clue if what it just wrote is true or not. I could bear it more if it said "I'm not sure, but..." But then if did that then none of the idiot CEOs would buy it, so here we are...

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  • [–] 2 points 1 day ago

    It is functioning in similar vain to idol statues placating and validating the idolmaker. In fact, that's my go to term for it because it's ridiculous for they practically deify this tech.

    These 'AIs' are still dependant on human input and human information (not knowledge) and the fact they follow a business model and not academical, means they are always seeking to earn a customer's approval as opposed to teaching a student what they need to know.

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  • [–] 25 points 2 days ago

    Any good thing is ruined once it's co-opted by capitalism.
    AI and LLMs (In my very very personal and completely subjective opinion) is the coolest shit humanity has ever invented and under the right system would've been unanimously celebrated.
    But noooooooo, capitalism had to go and fucking turn a miraculous tool for human creativity and knowledge into a relentless driver of layoffs, corporate slop and copyright theft because some greedy fucks want more money for themselves than they know what to do with.
    But, well, that's just, like, my opinion, man.

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  • [–] 34 points 2 days ago* (2 children)

    The problem is it’s designed to bullshit you. Why would I trust a foundational problem?

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  • [–] 9 points 2 days ago

    My buddy works for the government in contracts and he's mid level. Anyways he has like 5 people directly under him, and they're younger, were low 40s they're like upper 20s. He said sometimes he gets things written for multimillion dollar contracts that are fucking crazy because they use AI sometimes. He's like "I don't care if you do, but for the love of God read it once or twice".

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  • [–] 17 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    The trouble is that intellectual property laws are so far behind technology that there's basically no way to implement this technology without fucking over the creators of IP.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    I don't understand why so many of the top comments omit this part

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  • [–] 3 points 2 days ago

    At work (big tech, ~100k employees) we had a panel about IP and AI. The guy presenting unironically said something along the lines of "it is of course a concern, but frankly it is something we will just ignore for now and see how the technology develops"

    I took that as "we do not give a fuck if it creates AGI, and if it crashes and burns it will be the bankrupcy lawyer's problem.

    so, yea, most people do not care

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  • [–] 20 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    Yes, because of the way its used, the way its presented, and how bad it is.

    Different people would hate it for different reasons tho

    The most common use for AI seems to be Nazi/Fascist/Republican propaganda. Basically anywhere you go is an endless number of bots pushing to defend neo-nazis, tell people that Trump totally isnt a pedophile, make posts about "If he had just complied he would have lived" etc etc etc.

    The subset of people who recognize this, would hate AI because its really only good as a propaganda mill.

    The next set would be because of the way its being pushed to replace workers, AI doesnt actually make the remaining workers jobs easier, and it doesnt do work more efficiently, its just another excuse to cut headcounts, make a shittier service and charge more for it.

    Finally is because its A) Very often wrong and B) Being used to replace actual critical thinking.

    Its a growing problem, especially in academia. Students are coming into college or high school with absolutely no idea how to do actual research, how to write a paper in a logical way, how to follow basic logic chains etc. And there is so much bad information being produced by AI now that its becoming harder and harder to find actual good information. For every doctor telling you to vaccinate kids, there are a dozen AI driven videos that have some person being confidently wrong about everything to do with vaccines.

    Are there still students who didnt cheat their way through high school with AI? yes.

    But they are becoming more and more rare.

    And given how wrong AI usually is (AI is very good at being confidently wrong), this means that we have a whole generation growing up who cant tell the difference between "Measles can kill you if you dont get vaccinated" and "Shooting gay people is a fun weekend activity"

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    [–] 2 points 1 day ago

    it would reduce it quite a bit. the whole house of cards economic thing not being a thing would help to.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 day ago

    it’s one segment of the problem but not all of it by far

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  • [–] 20 points 2 days ago*

    There are 3 reasons people hate AI right now:

    1. Being used poorly and mostly resulting in slop, or malicious/unethical/deadly uses, and psychosis
    2. Being forced down the public's throat and put into places where it adds no value, job losses, quality drops, plagiarism
    3. Datacenter/environmental concerns, part prices

    So switching to local AI fixes problem 3 (mostly). But we also need the hype bubble to pop so number 2 goes away. Unfortunately the first problem will be hardest to fix and right now requires the public backlash as new norms are being formed and bad actors need to be called out.

    That said, I think we're about 1 to 3 years away from the bubble popping and everything starting to balance out to where AI is treated more like just a tool rather than a genie in a box. The hype will fade out and one or two of the big players will die, but at this point I don't think generative AI use is going away

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  • [–] 5 points 2 days ago

    No, it would be less hated. Maybe only detested instead of loathed.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 days ago*

    This song says it perfectly:

    We made AI so we could do the fun stuff
    While it could do the dumb stuff
    But now it does the fun stuff
    And we've become the dumb stuff

    It's taking all the interesting and fun creative work, leaving people to make sure all the t's are crossed and the i's are dotted.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 days ago

    It would still be anti-labor and a force multiplier for confident stupidity.

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  • [–] 9 points 2 days ago* (1 child)

    Qwen 3.6 27B has similar capabilities to Claude Sonnet 4.6 for coding, but uses about as much power for inference as playing a game on the gaming PC running it, compared to Sonnet that probably runs on like 8 B200s in a data center. If people were mostly just running open weight models on gaming PCs with no tech bros involved, I don’t think we’d be seeing the same level of outrage.

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    [–] 7 points 2 days ago

    Resource intensive is one thing, theft is another. Pay all the artists for using their art and we'll begin to talk about whether destroying the planet further is worth it.

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  • [–] 6 points 2 days ago* (1 child)

    The hardware and power shortages piss me off in particular because I'm a computers guy. But I also have friends who are writers and digital artists so I hate it for how it impacts them too. So 'as much'? No, but it'd still be hated.

    edit: also I play TTRPGs so i hate it for polluting image aggregators too

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  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago

    I was at a scientific conference a while ago and someone said "did you know there's a piece of software that can check if any of your papers have been scraped by AI?" So everyone checked. And everyone's papers had been scraped. Everyone's.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 days ago

    I would still hate it for being jammed into everythibg it doesn't need to be and being a shittier version of searches that used to work and being completely unreliable.

    So slightly less.

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  • [–] 6 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    The question has already been asked yesterday. It makes people lazy and stupid, that's my main issue.

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  • [–] 5 points 2 days ago

    And it makes people who were already stupid think they're smart.

    Nothing quite like arguing against a second-hand LLM conversation in your area of expertise, being proxied by someone who doesn't understand what either you, or it are saying.

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  • [–] 6 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

    There are still more major problems and risks than I can count on my hands

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  • [–] 5 points 2 days ago (4 children)

    "AI" is the wrong term, and I hate that it's been implanted. These are prediction models.

    Prediction models can be extremely beneficial. Think of weather forecasting, for example. Being able to predict power usage across a grid to prevent failures and increase efficiency and properly deploy resources. Even LLMs can be useful to give you a starting point for discovering information that you are short on. (Don't trust implicitly, double check, but you'll have new search terms to use.)

    Remember, too, that the publicly available models are relatively weak. Specialized models with well-curated training data are going to be much better at doing their specific prediction. And we're still in the beginning of this era. It's going to be crazy in ten years.

    With regard to resource intensity, it'sy understanding that creation of images and video is what demands the most computing power. And that kind of usage sucks all the way around.

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    [–] 5 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    I suspect yes. Even if you take these considerations out of the equation, AI is largely still just a glorified plagiarism machine being shoved down our throats.

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    [–] 5 points 2 days ago* (1 child)

    If it were truly actually accurate maybe not... but the issue is it is a syncophancy machine being obtusely oversold as capable of multitudes of things it cannot intrinsically do accurately or as well as a person with critical thinking and is being trained on fallible data sets that include human error and now hallucination from LLMs.

    If it actually were capable of doing everything the people selling you on AI are trying to get you to believe it would be an incredible tool, but it isnt, and it isnt being treated as a tool.

    I think it also does us a disservice as human beings because we are at risk of losing the ability to do our own problem-solving and process of logic bedause it can be offloaded to something else and that imho can manifest as a learned helplessness.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    LLM and AI are two circles in a Venn diagram.

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