1533
All the other brands went along (slrpnk.net)
submitted 2 years ago by to c/technology@lemmy.world
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[–] 99 points 2 years ago (8 children)

USB C is the best thing to happen to peripherals since the mouse.

I would agree with you if there were a simple way to tell what the USB-C cable I have in my hand can be used for without knowing beforehand. Otherwise, for example, I don't know whether the USB-C cable will charge my device or not. There should have been a simple way to label them for usage that was baked into the standard. As it is, the concept is terrific, but the execution can be extremely frustrating.

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  • [–] 49 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Hey that's a fair point. Funny how often good ideas are kneecapped by crap executions.

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  • [–] 40 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    I’m pretty sure the phrase “kneecapped by crap executions” is in the USB working groups’s charter. It’s like one of their core guiding principles.

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  • [–] 24 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    If anyone disagrees with this, the original USB spec was for a reversible connector and the only reason we didn't get to have that the whole time was because they wanted to increase profit margins.

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  • [–] 6 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 child)

    That’s the reason Apple released the Lightning connector. They pushed for several features for USB around 2010, including a reversible connector, but the USB-IF refused. Apple wanted USB-C, but couldn’t wait for the USB-IF to come to an agreement so they could replace the dated 20-pin connector.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    Burn all the USBC cables with fire except PD. The top PD cable does everything the lower cable does.

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  • [–] 11 points 2 years ago

    IDK I’ve had PD cables that looked good for a while but turns out their data rate was basically USB2. It seems no matter what rule of thumb I try there are always weird caveats.

    No, I’m not bitter, why would you ask that?

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  • [–] 10 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    There are many PD cables that are bad for doing data.

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  • [–] 8 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 child)

    Correct. The other commenter is giving bad advice.

    Both power delivery and bandwidth are backwards compatible, but they are independent specifications on USB-C cables. You can even get PD capable USB-C cables that don’t transmit data at all.

    Also, that’s not true for Thunderbolt cables. Each of the 5 versions have specific data and power delivery minimum and maximum specifications.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    You can even get PD capable USB-C cables that don’t transmit data at all.

    I don't think this is right. The PD standard requires the negotiation of which side is the source and which is the sink, and the voltage/amperage, over those data links. So it has to at least support the bare minimum data transmission in order for PD to work.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 child)

    Technically, yes, data must transmit to negotiate, but it doesn’t require high throughput. So you’ll get USB 2.0 transfer speeds (480 Mb/s) with most “charging only” USB-C cables. That’s only really useful for a keyboard or mouse these days.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    You forgot thunderbolt and usb4 exists now

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  • [–] 2 points 2 years ago

    True but pretty much the only devices that need those are high-end SSDs and laptop docks and in both cases you just leave the cable with the device rather than pulling it out of your generic cables drawer.

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  • [–] 10 points 2 years ago

    Buying a basic, no-frills USB-C cable from a reputable tech manufacturer all but guarantees that it'll work for essentially any purpose. Of course the shoddy pack-in cables included with a cheap device purchase won't work well.

    I replaced every USB-C-to-C or -A-to-C cable and brick in my house and carry bag with a very low cost Anker cable (except the ones that came with my Google products, those are fine), and now anything charges on any cable.

    You wouldn't say that a razor sucked just because the cheap replacement blades you bought at the dollar store nicked your face, or that a pan was too confusing because the dog food you cooked in it didn't taste good. So too it is not the fault of USB-C that poorly manufactured charging bricks and cables exist. The standard still works; in fact, it works so well that unethical companies are flooding the market with crap.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Do not all USB C cables have the capability to do Power Delivery? I thought it was up to the port you plugged it in to support it?

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  • [–] 8 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Nope. My daughter is notorious for mixing up cables when they come out of the brick. Some charge her tablet, some are for data transfer, some charge other devices but not her tablet. It's super confusing. I had to start labeling them for her.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Come to think of it, all the USB C cables I have are from phone and device chargers so I just took it for granted. Good to know. Thanks for sharing some knowledge with me

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  • [–] 8 points 2 years ago

    USB-c cables can vary drastically. Power delivery alone ranges from less than 1 amp at 5 volts to over 5 amps at 20 volts. That's 5 watts of power on the low end to 100 watts of power on the high end and sometimes more. When a cable meant to run at 5 watts has over 100 watts of power run through, the wires get really hot and could catch fire. The charger typically needs to talk to a very small chip in the high power cables for the cables to say, yes I can handle the power. Really cheap chargers might just push that power out regardless. So while the USB-c form factor is the one plug to rule them all, the actual execution is a fucking mess.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago*

    The really janky ones you get with like USB gadgets like fans only have the 2 power lines hooked up and not the lines needed to communicate PD support, those will work exactly the same as the same janky USB A-microUSB cables they used to come with, supplying 5V/2A. You throw those away the second you get them and replace them with the decent quality cables you bought in bulk from AmazonBasics or something.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 years ago

    Yeah, I totally get that there is a need for cheap power only cables, but why are there what feels like 30 different data "standards". Just gimme power-only, data, and fast-data. And yeah, in 2 years there'll be a faster data protocol, so what, that's then fast-data24, fast-data26, etc. and manufacturers have to use a specific pictogram to label them according to the highest standard they fulfill.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Agreed. They should be labeled with the rating.

    This little guy works wonders for me.

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002371533933.html

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  • [–] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Oh very cool! And you can't beat that price. Thanks.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago

    There should have been a simple way to label them for usage that was baked into the standard.

    There is. USB IF provides an assortment of logos and guidelines for ports and cables to clearly mark data speed (like "10Gbps"), power output (like "100W" or "5A"), whether the port is used for charging (battery icon), etc. But most manufacturers choose not to actually use them for ports.

    Cables I've seen usually are a bit better about labeling. I have some from Anker and ugreen that say "SS”, "10Gbps", or "100W". If they don't label the power it's probably 3A and if they don't label the data speed it's usually USB 2.0, though I have seen a couple cables that support 3.0 and don't label it.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    I would agree with you if there were a simple way to tell what the USB-C cable I have in my hand

    https://caberqu.com/home/39-ble-caberqu-0611816327412.html

    This would do it.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Damn, check out the price of the thing someone else linked to at AliExpress for a fraction of that price. But having to spend money on that should not be necessary.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago* (1 child)

    That aliexpress device doesn't tell you what wattage or data speed the cable will max out doing. Just what wattage it's currently doing (to which you'd need to make sure that the device you're testing with on the other side is capable and not having it's own issues). Also can't tell you if the cable is have intermittent problems. If all you care about is wattage, then fine. But I find myself caring more about the supported data speeds and quality of the cable.

    But yes, I agree that cables should just be marked what they're rated for... However it's possible well built cables exceed that spec and could do better than they're claiming which just puts us in the same boat of not really knowing.

    Edit: oh! and that aliexpress tester is only 4 lines(usb2.0 basically)... usb 3.0 in type c is 24 pins... You're not testing jack shit on that aliexpress. The device I linked will actually map the pins in the cable and will find you breaks as well.

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