▲ 1116 ▼ xkcd #2948: Electric vs Gas (xkcd.com) submitted 2 years ago by schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de to c/xkcd@lemmy.world 728 comments fedilink hide all child comments Alt text: An idling gas engine may be annoyingly loud, but that's the price you pay for having WAY less torque available at a standstill.
[–] lauha@lemmy.one 106 points 2 years ago (4 children) Non renewable solar energy unfortunately. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] cron@feddit.de 10 points 2 years ago (1 child) Renewable fuels exist and are used today, but the efficiency and pollution aspects still apply. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Revan343@lemmy.ca 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) If you're making your diesel from CO2 pulled from the air, pollution aspects don't really apply (at least, CO2 emission issues don't, there's still NOx, but that's what cat piss is for). Problem is, converting atmospheric CO2 back into fuel makes the efficiency issue drastically worse. Maybe with enough solar panels and windmills, and use the Fischer–Tropsch process with the excess energy that the grid isn't consuming. Of course, that would be for mobile fuel, if solar plants were going to do anything like that for later use generating electricity during peaks, making diesel is dumb; you'd want to use hydrogen or ammonia for in-place energy storage. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] cron@feddit.de 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) I was thinking about fuels like HVO. They work well, but have their own ecological implications. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Revan343@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 years ago Ah. I'm generally skeptical of any plant-based 'green fuel' because they generally take up agricultural capacity that would otherwise be producing food permalink fedilink source parent [–] rmuk@feddit.uk 5 points 2 years ago (4 children) No, it's renewable. But... not in any practical timeframe. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] KevonLooney@lemm.ee 51 points 2 years ago (1 child) That's not the definition of renewable. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] lauha@lemmy.one -8 points 2 years ago It is iv we use it sustainably. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Delta_V@lemmy.world 45 points 2 years ago (1 child) Not really. Its trees from a time before micro organisms evolved the ability to eat dead trees. These days, the solar energy collected by trees will get used to power the metabolisms of fungi before those trees can get buried and eventually become new coal & petroleum. I suppose an impact from a sufficiently large asteroid could turn the entire crust of the planet into magma, sterilizing it and therefore opening the possibility that new oil might be created some day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] AEsheron@lemmy.world 31 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) IIRC it is actually mostly from algea. A small amount from some fern-like plants. By the time trees existed, they were being broken down by bacteria. permalink fedilink source parent [–] lauha@lemmy.one 8 points 2 years ago I think I read somewhere that oil will not be produced anymore because now bacteria can break down that biomass that it previously didn't. Hence, non-renewable even on long timescales. permalink fedilink source parent [–] AeonFelis@lemmy.world -1 points 2 years ago* (1 child) Only if we bring back the dinosaurs. There are six movies (and counting!) explaining why this is not a good idea. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Scubus@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 years ago Technically no. Only if we erase bacteria capable of breaking down trees. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RogueBanana@lemmy.zip 2 points 2 years ago Energy density is a huge advantage which most people find hard to give up especially when the biggest problem that we face is invisible to most people. We can't fix a problem if we ignore the cause. permalink fedilink source parent [–] lnxtx@feddit.nl 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Happy cake day! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] AVincentInSpace@pawb.social 8 points 2 years ago A lot of people have been having their cake days recently. Guess it's the first anniversary of the Reddit exodus. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] cron@feddit.de 10 points 2 years ago (1 child) Renewable fuels exist and are used today, but the efficiency and pollution aspects still apply. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Revan343@lemmy.ca 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) If you're making your diesel from CO2 pulled from the air, pollution aspects don't really apply (at least, CO2 emission issues don't, there's still NOx, but that's what cat piss is for). Problem is, converting atmospheric CO2 back into fuel makes the efficiency issue drastically worse. Maybe with enough solar panels and windmills, and use the Fischer–Tropsch process with the excess energy that the grid isn't consuming. Of course, that would be for mobile fuel, if solar plants were going to do anything like that for later use generating electricity during peaks, making diesel is dumb; you'd want to use hydrogen or ammonia for in-place energy storage. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] cron@feddit.de 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) I was thinking about fuels like HVO. They work well, but have their own ecological implications. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Revan343@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 years ago Ah. I'm generally skeptical of any plant-based 'green fuel' because they generally take up agricultural capacity that would otherwise be producing food permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Revan343@lemmy.ca 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) If you're making your diesel from CO2 pulled from the air, pollution aspects don't really apply (at least, CO2 emission issues don't, there's still NOx, but that's what cat piss is for). Problem is, converting atmospheric CO2 back into fuel makes the efficiency issue drastically worse. Maybe with enough solar panels and windmills, and use the Fischer–Tropsch process with the excess energy that the grid isn't consuming. Of course, that would be for mobile fuel, if solar plants were going to do anything like that for later use generating electricity during peaks, making diesel is dumb; you'd want to use hydrogen or ammonia for in-place energy storage. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] cron@feddit.de 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) I was thinking about fuels like HVO. They work well, but have their own ecological implications. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Revan343@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 years ago Ah. I'm generally skeptical of any plant-based 'green fuel' because they generally take up agricultural capacity that would otherwise be producing food permalink fedilink source parent
[–] cron@feddit.de 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) I was thinking about fuels like HVO. They work well, but have their own ecological implications. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Revan343@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 years ago Ah. I'm generally skeptical of any plant-based 'green fuel' because they generally take up agricultural capacity that would otherwise be producing food permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Revan343@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 years ago Ah. I'm generally skeptical of any plant-based 'green fuel' because they generally take up agricultural capacity that would otherwise be producing food permalink fedilink source parent
[–] rmuk@feddit.uk 5 points 2 years ago (4 children) No, it's renewable. But... not in any practical timeframe. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] KevonLooney@lemm.ee 51 points 2 years ago (1 child) That's not the definition of renewable. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] lauha@lemmy.one -8 points 2 years ago It is iv we use it sustainably. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Delta_V@lemmy.world 45 points 2 years ago (1 child) Not really. Its trees from a time before micro organisms evolved the ability to eat dead trees. These days, the solar energy collected by trees will get used to power the metabolisms of fungi before those trees can get buried and eventually become new coal & petroleum. I suppose an impact from a sufficiently large asteroid could turn the entire crust of the planet into magma, sterilizing it and therefore opening the possibility that new oil might be created some day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] AEsheron@lemmy.world 31 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) IIRC it is actually mostly from algea. A small amount from some fern-like plants. By the time trees existed, they were being broken down by bacteria. permalink fedilink source parent [–] lauha@lemmy.one 8 points 2 years ago I think I read somewhere that oil will not be produced anymore because now bacteria can break down that biomass that it previously didn't. Hence, non-renewable even on long timescales. permalink fedilink source parent [–] AeonFelis@lemmy.world -1 points 2 years ago* (1 child) Only if we bring back the dinosaurs. There are six movies (and counting!) explaining why this is not a good idea. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Scubus@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 years ago Technically no. Only if we erase bacteria capable of breaking down trees. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] KevonLooney@lemm.ee 51 points 2 years ago (1 child) That's not the definition of renewable. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] lauha@lemmy.one -8 points 2 years ago It is iv we use it sustainably. permalink fedilink source parent
[+] lauha@lemmy.one -8 points 2 years ago It is iv we use it sustainably. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Delta_V@lemmy.world 45 points 2 years ago (1 child) Not really. Its trees from a time before micro organisms evolved the ability to eat dead trees. These days, the solar energy collected by trees will get used to power the metabolisms of fungi before those trees can get buried and eventually become new coal & petroleum. I suppose an impact from a sufficiently large asteroid could turn the entire crust of the planet into magma, sterilizing it and therefore opening the possibility that new oil might be created some day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] AEsheron@lemmy.world 31 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) IIRC it is actually mostly from algea. A small amount from some fern-like plants. By the time trees existed, they were being broken down by bacteria. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] AEsheron@lemmy.world 31 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) IIRC it is actually mostly from algea. A small amount from some fern-like plants. By the time trees existed, they were being broken down by bacteria. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] lauha@lemmy.one 8 points 2 years ago I think I read somewhere that oil will not be produced anymore because now bacteria can break down that biomass that it previously didn't. Hence, non-renewable even on long timescales. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] AeonFelis@lemmy.world -1 points 2 years ago* (1 child) Only if we bring back the dinosaurs. There are six movies (and counting!) explaining why this is not a good idea. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Scubus@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 years ago Technically no. Only if we erase bacteria capable of breaking down trees. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Scubus@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 years ago Technically no. Only if we erase bacteria capable of breaking down trees. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] RogueBanana@lemmy.zip 2 points 2 years ago Energy density is a huge advantage which most people find hard to give up especially when the biggest problem that we face is invisible to most people. We can't fix a problem if we ignore the cause. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] lnxtx@feddit.nl 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Happy cake day! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] AVincentInSpace@pawb.social 8 points 2 years ago A lot of people have been having their cake days recently. Guess it's the first anniversary of the Reddit exodus. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] AVincentInSpace@pawb.social 8 points 2 years ago A lot of people have been having their cake days recently. Guess it's the first anniversary of the Reddit exodus. permalink fedilink source parent