The stark question was posed to Trump’s attorney John Sauer by Judge Florence Pan: Was a president immune from prosecution for any unlawful act, at all? Could a president order his political rivals to be assassinated by Seal Team 6 as an official act? Could he sell pardons at his pleasure if he saw fit and then face no consequences for his actions?

“He would have to be impeached and convicted first,” Sauer replied,

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[–] 152 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (9 children)

How on EARTH did the judge miss his chance to ask the obvious follow-up.

"Does this apply to Biden also? Can he murder his political rivals under your legal theory? Can he murder your client?"

"Why not?"

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  • [–] [S] 54 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    The judge definitely called out Trump's lawyer tho

    Judge Henderson cited this specifically on Tuesday when hearing arguments from Sauer.

    Trump, she told him, said he couldn’t be prosecuted while he was in office, but he also conceded that he could be prosecuted once he was out.

    Logic doesn't work with trumpets tho, they just say whatever happens to help them the most in the moment.

    Here pretty soon they'll start saying it's too close to the election, so this has to be postponed.

    If he wins, they'll say it has to wait till after, then they'll start over in the beginning.

    trumps lawyers are just going to stall as long as they can.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Whoa, hey, trumpets are cool. Don't despoil them like that!

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  • [–] 17 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    "That depends. Are you going to force his estate to pay the rest of my legal bills? If so, then yes. If not, then no."

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    [–] 66 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

    Oh wow, what a big fucking surprise. Trump's team is now arguing he can't be charged because he wasn't impeached. Yet 4 years ago, the cowards in the GOP said they couldn't impeach him and it was up to the courts to take responsibility for punishing Trump.

    Who could have guessed that these slimy fucks would do that? Everyone?

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  • [–] 48 points 2 years ago* (2 children)

    Taken to it's logical conclusion, this idea would basically posit that all the president must do to become a dictator is take out the whole Senate at once, or just have absolute loyalists in enough of the seats, or a combination of the two. If there's no Senate, the president can't be impeached and convicted, and if the president cant be held accountable for anything unless that happens, then they can illegally stop any new elections to get new senators with no consequences (or a new president for that matter) and act with impunity.

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  • [–] 32 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Taken to it’s logical conclusion, this idea would basically posit that all the president must do to become a dictator is take out the whole Senate at once, or just have absolute loyalists in enough of the seats, or a combination of the two

    Didn't they sorta try that 3 years ago? Shouldn't that be a huge red flag for this argment?

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  • [–] 29 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    They have a much more rigorous plan for this now. The following is a link to the published 970 page manual on how the GOP intends to take permanent control of the US.

    https://thf_media.s3.amazonaws.com/project2025/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdf

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  • [–] 14 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    The 2025 Presidential Transition Project is the conservative movement’s unified effort to be ready for the next conservative Administration to govern at 12:00 noon, January 20, 2025. Welcome to the mission. By opening this book, you are now a part of it

    Fuck.

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  • [–] 11 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    What in the fuck Is this? This may as well be The Protocols of the Elders of Zion 2.0

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  • [–] 18 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    This is the plan created by the most influential members of the GOP, the most influential organizations on them, and the most influential individuals on them. Over 50 of the most important organizations to the GOP published this thing. If you read it there are whole paragraphs that have been, almost verbatim, said by Trump, and other GOP members, since it's publishing. This is their schematic to build a modern fascist state. They aren't hiding it. This isn't a document they are passing around in tight circles, hiding it from outsiders. This is a publicly posted manifest on their plans to take control of the US government, dismantle the checks and balances of power, and take complete control.

    They even acknowledge that methods they intend to use are legally dubious, then acknowledge that that is why they stacked the USSC.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    The Protocols of the Elders of Zion was written by folks making shit up to try to stir up antisemitism. Project 2025 was written by actual "conservative organizations": https://www.project2025.org/about/advisory-board/

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  • [–] 4 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    What I'm meaning to illustrate is that this reads like "The Protocols" in that it seems to be filled with fear mongering of a deep state that the world needs to be protected from. Promoting a call to arms for conservative voters.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

    I see. I was thrown because the "Protocols" took the form of a fake leaked document revealing a fictitious plan for world domination, claiming to be written by Jewish elders, but actually written by an antisemitic propagandist. So given that this is also a plan for world domination and is horrifying those who read it, it seemed like you might be suggesting it was a fake created by left-wingers to discredit the right. Sadly, it's all too real, and it's not leaked--it's all out in the open for those who bother to look.

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  • [–] 34 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

    Hmm sounds like the whole "balance of power in the 3 branches of government" is being completely ignored by this dumb lawyer.

    The executive branch must be held accountable by more than just the Senate... Otherwise there might as well only be 2 branches of power and the justice system would fall under the umbrella of the executive branch.

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  • [–] 32 points 2 years ago

    Then go on Biden. Do your thing Mr. King.

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  • [–] 31 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    This is basically trump arguing for the return of the Divine Right of Kings

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  • [–] 29 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    What kind of trash lawyer is this lmao. He got served a bait question and took it.

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  • [–] 8 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    I'm starting to think he's sharing lawyers with Alex Jones

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  • [–] 20 points 2 years ago

    Yeah because that's the sign of a healthy democracy... Red flag #47653.

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  • [–] 18 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    If he has to be impeached and convicted by the Senate then his lawyers would argue that he can't be prosecuted afterward because of the double jeopardy clause. This would completely nullify the constitution and the United States of America would cease to exist as we know it. That's the Republican endgame.

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  • [–] 6 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Putting aside the whole Republican duplicity thing, I don't think this is double jeopardy.

    Impeachment is, in essence, a political procedure to remove someone from office. There doesn't need to even be a crime (see Biden's impeachment for an example).

    So assuming for a moment that a president was impeached, that trial is to remove him from office, not to try him for a crime.

    And even then, impeachment trials are civil where there is no jeopardy.

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  • [–] 16 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    I look forward to how SCOTUS Bush v Gore'ing this, granting Trump immunity, and saying "this is not a precedent".

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  • [–] 14 points 2 years ago

    Not the flex they think it is...

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  • [–] 13 points 2 years ago

    Is this the lawyers way of saying "please kill my client Mr president".

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