The U.S. job market turned weaker last month, dashing hopes for an economic rebound.

A report from the Labor Department on Friday shows employers cut 92,000 jobs in February, when economists had expected the U.S. would continue adding jobs, albeit at a sluggish pace. The unemployment rate inched up to 4.4%.

Job gains for December and January were also revised downward, with December now showing a net loss 17,000 jobs.

The weaker than expected jobs report comes as Americans are already anxious about the high cost of living. Those affordability concerns will likely be amplified as the war in Iran has triggered a sharp rise in energy prices. AAA reports the average price of gasoline jumped another 7 cents overnight, to $3.32 a gallon. That's 21 cents higher than this time last year.

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[–] 131 points 5 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] 15 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    2 days ago:

    https://money.usnews.com/money/personal-finance/articles/employers-add-63-000-jobs-in-february-beating-forecasts

    Employers added 63,000 jobs in February as the pace of job creation quickened and beat estimates, private payroll firm ADP said on Wednesday.

    Economists had forecast a gain of 48,000 following January’s downwardly revised 11,000 increase – half the original estimate.

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  • [–] 18 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    I expected that was all lies, so it's still expected. Unless you believed the lies. But then that would be on you. I also expect that the job losses actually are well in excess of 100,000. There's no way the administration would give anything but the flimsiest lowball number they think wouldn't get called out immediately.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (1 child)

    They're not lies, they're estimates based off of ADP statistics.

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  • [–] 11 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    There's 3 kinds of lies. Lies, damned lies, and statistics. Our unemployment numbers are purposefully bullshit and have been for years too.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    Do you have any sources for that? I'd love to read up on it.

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  • [–] 12 points 5 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 7 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Yes, their methodology. Exclusion of discouraged workers, part-time workers wanting full-time work, and strict "actively seeking work" definitions ensure the numbers don't actually reflect the reality. But rather the more rosy fiction those in power wish to push.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    So no resources that I can read?

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Well, if someone points out the official methodology is designed to undercount. One might want to read said methodology. Apart from that, the Internet is your oyster, as well as cable news. Pick a source you find reputable. Fox and NBC point it out any time its advantageous to their chosen candidate. Even trump remarked on it himself in 2023 to attack biden. There are clips from Maddow from 15 years ago talking about it under Obama too. It's a chestnut old as time used to attack those in power, but never with intent to fix the systemic problem.

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago*

    The TL;DR version is that the unemployment numbers that tend to get reported are U-3, whereas many people think the U-6 numbers are a more accurate reflection of the real experience.

    The U-3 unemployment rate is the most commonly reported rate in the United States, representing the number of unemployed people actively seeking a job. Meanwhile, the U-6 rate covers discouraged, underemployed, and unemployed workers in the country.

    https://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/080415/true-unemployment-rate-u6-vs-u3.asp

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  • [–] 8 points 5 months ago

    Economists had forecast a gain of 48,000 following January’s downwardly revised 11,000 increase – half the original estimate.

    That means the prediction was 22k new juobs, had just been decreased to 11k new jobs, and then shot up to 48k...

    That's not a sign that we should expect good things, that was a sign that someone may have caved from pressure after saying 11k.and went with a number that was obviously bullshit.

    Apparently some people believed it tho, so I can admit when I'm wrong. I tend to overestimate people

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago

    After the Great Financial Crisis it became clear to me that weasel word "economists" either have no idea what they're doing, or don't actually serve the public. These days I'm leaning more towards the latter.

    Not to say that the greats like Adam Smith were unqualified. But the legion of yes-men who have been drinking corporate kool-aid since Nixon don't work for us. Their job is to create a convincing narrative as to why it's OK to have a visibly unhealthy economy.

    Don't trust unnamed "economists" in the news. Look for specific people who have predicted what the economy actually does, and listen to them.

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  • [–] 43 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Don't worry everyone, the rich are doing just fine.

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  • [–] 35 points 5 months ago* (2 children)

    Unexpectedly.

    You know, there are reasons I'm not employed as an econometrician any more.

    Like telling people things they don't wanna hear.

    I'm done with tables and numbers and statistical models now.

    Memes will suffice.

    EDIT:

    And if any fucking idiot shows up to use the phrase 'Black Swan', incorrectly, again, I'm gonna take them on a hunting trip like Dick Cheney would.

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  • [–] 8 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    I'll bite, what's the black swan thingy and why is it wrong ?

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  • [–] 12 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 child)

    Nassim Taleb popularized, in the mid to late 2000's, the concept of an actually unforseeable risk, that there was absolutely no way to price in to any risk assessment models, because it was a totally unprecedented occurrence, a thing that legitimately had never happened before, that could not be forseeable as possible given prior history/knowledge that you have access to.

    Based around the idea of I think some European explorers being totally flabbergasted upon seeing the first black swan that they'd ever seen, their entire previous experience and culture teaching them that swans were always white.

    The entire idea was that these kinds of things do actually happen, historically, with fairly decent regularity.

    But, a whole bunch of people who I guess just skim-read Taleb's writings... just took a 'Black Swan Event' to mean 'something very uncommon'.

    ... Which is missing the point entirely.

    Because 'something very uncommon' very often is something that is considered, is modelled in as a possibility (just a low possibility) in risk evaluation models.

    A Black Swan Event on the other hand is supposed to be something that escapes that, that could not even exist as any kind of a possibility in your risk model.

    Basically, if I can run through a list of assumptions your risk model makes, and then describe scenarios where those assumptions are broken, and how that changes your risk model... those aren't really Black Swan events, especially if I can also model the chances of your assumptions being wrong, based on ... you know, other times those kinds of assumptions have turned out to be wrong, in the past.


    Consider the insurance/legal concept of 'an act of God'.

    Its... not literally meant to mean an actual act of God, its meant to mean something out of any involved party's direct control.

    ... But you can still build entire sophisticated risk models based around the likelihood that 'God' will do a particular thing at a particular point in time.


    The phrase Black Swan Event was invented to try and convince people that they should probably be double checking their investment/insurance strategies, should probably lower their overall risk appetite compared to what existing models tell you it should be, that people should be more conservative with money, have backup/contingency plans, because those models often, provably, fail to appreciate or understand or imagine hitherto unprecedented events.

    But, a bunch of morons just started using the term as an excuse for themselves when things happened that they did know were possible, just didn't think were likely.

    Or, as an excuse for things that... fairly easily could be modelled, if they had done proper underwriting, used more comprehensive, already existing metholodologies... but well that's hard and takes time and involves more work!

    The exact opposite of what Taleb was trying to get people to do.


    Consider the recent massive downward revisions to job gains numbers by the BLS.

    ... Downward revisions to initial jobs reports happen all the time, very common.

    Its uncommon that they happen to such a great magnitude...

    But... its modellable, literally just based on the history of BLS reports themselves, not even comparing to other data sets.

    But but! ... Most people don't pay any attention to the revisions, they just go with the first initial report, don't bother to keep track of the growing, rising innacuracy of initial vs final/revised jobs numbers.

    Then, when you do what risk modellers are supposed to do, and take in as many indicators, as much useful.data as you can from other sources... well, you actually can find patterns that strongly indicate when such an error is likely currently occuring in your one data set (BLS jobs) that doesn't seem to match all the other ones.

    (If you're even like a professional at this or something, you'll deep dive into the precise methodology of how such data is gathered, to essentially audit it.)

    People who want to believe the fairly tale act surprised and make excuses, while people like me have been making the argument that ... yeah the BLS numbers are crap... before they were revealed as such.

    Thus... not a black swan event.

    In fact, a very expected event... if you remain skeptical and diligent, are aware that no one is immune to propoganda, hype, FOMO, etc.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    So, in order for the unexpected number to be caused by a Black Swan event, the event has to be unaccounted for in modelling. If the number has a 0.1% chance of happening but is caused by variables that were accounted for, it doesn't count. Is this correct?

    And a number that had 50% chance of happening can also be caused by a BS event. Basically the status of BS event is unrelated to the probabilty of the resulting numbers.

    And now I'm not sure of what I should do with that concept

    I see how it could get used as a variant of "the future can never be determined with full certainty and therefore I can't be blamed for anything"

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  • [–] 24 points 5 months ago (4 children)
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    [–] 24 points 5 months ago

    "unexpectedly"

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  • [–] 21 points 5 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago

    Exactly. Diaper Don tariffing everything that moves, for one, and sending "doge" in to fire tons of government workers:

    Gosh and gee willickers, you mean that will have a negative impact on things?

    --Murc's Law Media and reactionary centrists everywhere

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  • [–] 14 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    How long before the reporting of jobs numbers becomes illegal by EO and then there’s just vague statements of the economy is doing great, it’s gone up by billinty blollars just this past month! You’re not suffering, you’re efficiency maxing!

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  • [–] 6 points 5 months ago

    Remember GWB's reaction to someone having THREE jobs?

    You work three jobs? Uniquely American, isn't it? I mean, that is fantastic that you're doing that.

    I'm imagining an administration with even less empathy reacting to people's experiences under an economy imploded by PEDOnald combined with AI delusions run amok.

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  • [–] 11 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    That’s a downwardly revised January gain of 126,000, and they had estimated a 50k gain for February. When was it we were told the Dow was over 50,000 again?

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  • [–] 10 points 5 months ago
    [–] 5 points 5 months ago

    Phhht. Probably thought they'd fill those jobs with AI, since they're so hard for it. Even though they have no freakin idea what it is or can do...

    Or more likely they didn't care to even fudge the numbers anymore because they plan on rigging every election to stay in power like the disgusting bloodsucking parasites like they are. They don't care if you are unhappy because what are you gonna do...

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago

    Are there any more worries to be had? This only makes sense now if the top 10% is starting to worry about the top 1%. Most of us aren't even in the game anymore (so let's invent a new game that we can all play).

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago

    My guess:

    Tariffs

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  • [+] 1 point 5 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago

    This title is getting saved as something that needs to get addressed when we try to refund public funding. Im all for it, but I also know NPRs tone police are a key component to the normalization of today's GOP.

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