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[–] 90 points 2 years ago (13 children)

As always, never rely on llms for anything factual. They're only good with things which have a massive acceptance for error, such as entertainment (eg rpgs)

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  • [–] 25 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    I tried using it to spit ball ideas for my DMing. I was running a campaign set in a real life location known for a specific thing. Even if I told it to not include that thing, it would still shoe horn it in random spots. It quickly became absolutely useless once I didn't need that thing included

    Sorry for being vague, I just didn't want to post my home town on here

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  • [–] 13 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    The issue for RPGs is that they have such "small" context windows, and a big point of RPGs is that anything could be important, investigated, or just come up later

    Although, similar to how deepseek uses two stages ("how would you solve this problem", then "solve this problem following this train of thought"), you could have an input of recent conversations and a private/unseen "notebook" which is modified/appended to based on recent events, but that would need a whole new model to be done properly which likely wouldn't be profitable short term, although I imagine the same infrastructure could be used for any LLM usage where fine details over a long period are more important than specific wording, including factual things

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  • [–] 13 points 2 years ago

    The problem is that the "train of the thought" is also hallucinations. It might make the model better with more compute but it's diminishing rewards.

    Rpg can use the llms because they're not critical. If the llm spews out nonsense you don't like, you just ask to redo, because it's all subjective.

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    [–] 65 points 2 years ago

    Idk guys. I think the headline is misleading. I had an AI chatbot summarize the article and it says AI chatbots are really, really good at summarizing articles. In fact it pinky promised.

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  • [–] 45 points 2 years ago (19 children)

    Turns out, spitting out words when you don't know what anything means or what "means" means is bad, mmmmkay.

    It got journalists who were relevant experts in the subject of the article to rate the quality of answers from the AI assistants.

    It found 51% of all AI answers to questions about the news were judged to have significant issues of some form.

    Additionally, 19% of AI answers which cited BBC content introduced factual errors, such as incorrect factual statements, numbers and dates.

    Introduced factual errors

    Yeah that's . . . that's bad. As in, not good. As in - it will never be good. With a lot of work and grinding it might be "okay enough" for some tasks some day. That'll be another 200 Billion please.

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  • [–] 9 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    that's the core problem though, isn't it. They are just predictive text machines, not understanding what they are saying. Yet we are treating them as if they were some amazing solution to all our problems

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    [–] 31 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    BBC is probably salty the AI is able to insert the word Israel alongside a negative term in the headline

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  • [–] 15 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

    Some examples of inaccuracies found by the BBC included:

    Gemini incorrectly said the NHS did not recommend vaping as an aid to quit smoking

    ChatGPT and Copilot said Rishi Sunak and Nicola Sturgeon were still in office even after they had left

    Perplexity misquoted BBC News in a story about the Middle East, saying Iran initially showed "restraint" and described Israel's actions as "aggressive"

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  • [–] 31 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (19 children)

    What temperature and sampling settings? Which models?

    I've noticed that the AI giants seem to be encouraging “AI ignorance,” as they just want you to use their stupid subscription app without questioning it, instead of understanding how the tools works under the hood. They also default to bad, cheap models.

    I find my local thinking models (FuseAI, Arcee, or Deepseek 32B 5bpw at the moment) are quite good at summarization at a low temperature, which is not what these UIs default to, and I get to use better sampling algorithms than any of the corporate APis. Same with “affordable” flagship API models (like base Deepseek, not R1). But small Gemini/OpenAI API models are crap, especially with default sampling, and Gemini 2.0 in particular seems to have regressed.

    My point is that LLMs as locally hosted tools you understand the mechanics/limitations of are neat, but how corporations present them as magic cloud oracles is like everything wrong with tech enshittification and crypto-bro type hype in one package.

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  • [–] 11 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    I've found Gemini overwhelmingly terrible at pretty much everything, it responds more like a 7b model running on a home pc or a model from two years ago than a medium commercial model in how it completely ignores what you ask it and just latches on to keywords... It's almost like they've played with their tokenisation or trained it exclusively for providing tech support where it links you to an irrelevant article or something

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  • [–] 8 points 2 years ago* (3 children)

    I don’t think giving the temperature knob to end users is the answer.

    Turning it to max for max correctness and low creativity won’t work in an intuitive way.

    Sure, turning it down from the balanced middle value will make it more “creative” and unexpected, and this is useful for idea generation, etc. But a knob that goes from “good” to “sort of off the rails, but in a good way” isn’t a great user experience for most people.

    Most people understand this stuff as intended to be intelligent. Correct. Etc. Or they At least understand that’s the goal. Once you give them a knob to adjust the “intelligence level,” you’ll have more pushback on these things not meeting their goals. “I clearly had it in factual/correct/intelligent mode. Not creativity mode. I don’t understand why it left out these facts and invented a back story to this small thing mentioned…”

    Not everyone is an engineer. Temp is an obtuse thing.

    But you do have a point about presenting these as cloud genies that will do spectacular things for you. This is not a great way to be executing this as a product.

    I loathe how these things are advertised by Apple, Google and Microsoft.

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  • [–] 5 points 2 years ago*
    • Temperature isn't even "creativity" per say, it's more a band-aid to patch looping and dryness in long responses.

    • Lower temperature is much better with modern sampling algorithms, E.G., MinP, DRY, maybe dynamic temperature like mirostat and such. Ideally, structure output, too. Unfortunately, corporate APIs usually don't offer this.

    • It can be mitigated with finetuning against looping/repetition/slop, but most models are the opposite, massively overtuning on their own output which "inbreeds" the model.

    • And yes, domain specific queries are best. Basically the user needs separate prompt boxes for coding, summaries, creative suggestions and such each with their own tuned settings (and ideally tuned models). You are right, this is a much better idea than offering a temperature knob to the user, but... most UIs don't even do this for some reason?

    What I am getting at is this is not a problem companies seem interested in solving.They want to treat the users as idiots without the attention span to even categorize their question.

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    [–] 25 points 2 years ago

    ShockedPikachu.svg

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  • [–] 24 points 2 years ago

    You don't say.

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  • [–] 21 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    But every techbro on the planet told me it's exactly what LLMs are good at. What the hell!? /s

    https://lemm.ee/comment/18029491

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  • [–] 13 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Not only techbros though. Most of my friends are not into computers but they all think AI is magical and will change the whole world for the better. I always ask "how can a blackbox that throws up random crap and runs on the computers of big companies out of the country would change anything?" They don't know what to say but they still believe something will happen and a program can magically become sentient. Sometimes they can be fucking dumb but I still love them.

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  • [–] 14 points 2 years ago (6 children)

    I learned that AI chat bots aren't necessarily trustworthy in everything. In fact, if you aren't taking their shit with a grain of salt, you're doing something very wrong.

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    [–] 12 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    I just tried it on deepseek it did it fine and gave the source for everything it mentioned as well.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 years ago

    Do you mean you rigorously went through a hundred articles, asking DeepSeek to summarise them and then got relevant experts in the subject of the articles to rate the quality of answers? Could you tell us what percentage of the summaries that were found to introduce errors then? Literally 0?

    Or do you mean that you tried having DeepSeek summarise a couple of articles, didn't see anything obviously problematic, and figured it is doing fine? Replacing rigorous research and journalism by humans with a couple of quick AI prompts, which is the core of the issue that the article is getting at. Because if so, please reconsider how you evaluate (or trust others' evaluations of) information tools which might help or help destroy democracy.

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    [–] 12 points 2 years ago* (2 children)

    They are, however, able to inaccurately summarize it in GLaDOS's voice, which is a strong point in their favor.

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    [–] 11 points 2 years ago

    Which is hilarious, because most of the shit out there today seems to be written by them.

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  • [–] 10 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    But the BBC is increasingly unable to accurately report the news, so this finding is no real surprise.

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    [–] 6 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    The owners of LLMs don't care about 'accurate' ... they care about 'fast' and 'summary' ... and especially 'profit' and 'monetization'.

    As long as it's quick, delivers instant content and makes money for someone ... no one cares about 'accurate'

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  • [–] 6 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    That's why I avoid them like the plague. I've even changed almost every platform I'm using to get away from the AI-pocalypse.

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  • [–] 10 points 2 years ago* (2 children)

    I can't stand the corporate double think.

    Despite the mountains of evidence that AI is not capable of something even basic as reading an article and telling you what is about it's still apparently going to replace humans. How do they come to that conclusion?

    The world won't be destroyed by AI, It will be destroyed by idiot venture capitalist types who reckon that AI is the next big thing. Fire everyone, replace it all with AI; then nothing will work and nobody will be able to buy anything because nobody has a job.

    Que global economic collapse.

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    [–] 5 points 2 years ago

    Fuckin news!

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  • [–] 4 points 2 years ago

    News station finds that AI is unable to perform the job of a news station

    🤔

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  • [–] 3 points 2 years ago

    Why, where they trained using MAIN STREAM NEWS? That could explain it.

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