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[–] 122 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Linus' power doesn't come from Ownership, but respect. Anyone can fork it and do what they want, but because Linus is respected, everyone else follows suit.

Anarchism would function in a similar manner, it wouldn't be a bunch of opinionated people doing whatever they want, but people generally listening to experts who don't actually hold systemic power.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    Problem is that the average person cannot discern between an actual expert and a charlatan.

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  • [–] 13 points 2 years ago

    Skilled programmers can see that Linus is an expert. It works in tech. It probably works in any professional environment - anywhere where skilled people are picking someone highly skilled.

    For the average person, we have clearly seen average people suck at picking expert leaders, though it works fine in small groups

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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    And yet Linux works fine. Not everyone needs to be a dev, devs can tell the difference between an expert and a charlatan.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

    I meant that as a reply to the second paragraph which generalised anarchism; including the non-Linux world.
    I also disagree that this isn't an issue in the broader Linux community however. See for example the loud minority with an irrational hate against quite obviously good software projects like systemd who got those ideas from charlatans or "experts".

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  • [–] 4 points 2 years ago

    I know, I used Linux as an example. Just like not everyone needs to be a weatherman to trust weatherman that can recognize experts among themselves, so too can engineers recognize experts among themselves, and so forth.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    I would disagree and say it's more akin to a philosopher king hence less anarchy and more monarchy. It's all good until the king dies and let's see who succeeds them.

    It will be most telling when Linus dies.

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  • [+] -15 points 2 years ago (5 children)

    How often does forking actually work in the real world? Pretty much never.

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  • [–] 16 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Many times, and it's always an option for FOSS software. What do you consider "working?" Mass adoption, or satisfying needs and use-cases?

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  • [+] -10 points 2 years ago (5 children)

    Many times what? Most forks die within a few months. Especially for big and well known projects. For example, io.js was a fork of NodeJs. Didn't last long and was killed by NodeJs. All the Firefox forks are pretty much dead as well. Linux also had plenty of forks by people who disagreed with Linus and where are they now? I bet you don't even remember their names.

    Forks don't work unless the original project is dead.

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  • [–] 17 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    This is incorrect. It's true that most (in fact, I would say almost all) forks go nowhere but that doesn't mean forking isn't incredibly valuable. Even the example you cite, "original project is dead" isn't just incidentally useful, it's critical to open source. Other examples include:

    • project's core team is part of a for profit org that is moving the project in a bad, profit motivated direction:
    • project's leader suddenly and dramatically loses respect (maybe he killed his wife or something);
    • project's leader dies without leaving a digital will regarding who controls the core repo;
    • project continues to direct effort into features while falling to address major security concerns;
    • project is healthy and useful in every way but there is an important use case not being addressed, and the fork would address it.

    Even if 99% of forks fail, that's irrelevant because 99% of original projects fail in the same ways. Forks are critical to open source.

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  • [+] -12 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Your comment doesn't make any sense, sorry.

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  • [–] 10 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    So mass adoption is your answer, and I'd say you're misguided. The purpose of FOSS isn't to make a profit, but to satisfy uses and needs. If a few people have a need for a fork and use it, then it's a success.

    You're judging FOSS software by popularity, rather than use, as though it's for profit.

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  • [+] -6 points 2 years ago (2 children)
  • [–] 5 points 2 years ago

    Most new businesses fail as well. Maybe we shouldn't be starting new businesses either? Or perhaps this more about people being unprepared and out of their depth whether it's starting a new business or forking a code base. And not the individual actions themselves.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    Nextcloud is a FOSS fork of OwnCloud. Both projects are great in their own way, hugely successful and serve a lot of people very well. They just moved in different directions.

    This is just one example of many. Ability to fork is super important to ensure that projects stay open source, like in this example.

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