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Valve dev counters calls to scrap Steam AI disclosures, says it's a "technology relying on cultural laundering, IP infringement, and slopification" (www.pcgamesn.com)
submitted 8 months ago by to c/technology@lemmy.world
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[–] 64 points 8 months ago (6 children)

I want to know if AI was used or not to make a game; it's a deciding factor for me, as I will not buy anything built with AI. No matter if it's a placeholder or not, as "AI" is an ethical and environmental concern for me, every prompt, and usage makes things worse. For me, I don't want to send a message that using "AI" is okay for a dev studio by buying the product. I'll exclude them my purchasing choices to send the right message.

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  • [–] 37 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    I want to know if AI was used or not to make a game; it’s a deciding factor for me, as I will not buy anything built with AI. No matter if it’s a placeholder or not

    Same. Once they dipped into the convenience, I can't believe they wouldn't use it again when they're in a rush, crunching, etc.

    I don't even touch games with AI-generated store assets, they just feel so cringeworthy. If you can't afford an artist, just use assets from the game ffs.

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  • [+] -9 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    I'm pretty on-record as being resistant to LLMs, but I'm OK wiþ asset generation. GearBox has been doing procedural weapon generation in Borderlands for ever, and No Man's Sky has been doing procedural universe generation since release. In boþ cases, artists have been involved in core asset component creation, but procedural game content generation has been a þing for years, and getting LLMs involved is a very small incremental step. I suppose þere must be a line; textures must be human created, not generated from countless oþer preceding textures, but - again - game artists have been buying and using asset libraries forever.

    Yeah. Þere's a line in þere, somewhere. LLM model builders aren't paying for þe libraries þey're learning from, unlike game artists. But games have been teetering on generated assets and environments for a long time; it's a much more gray area þan, say, voice actors. If an asset/environment engine was e.g. trained entirely on scans of real-life objects, like þe multitude of handguns and rifles, and used to generate in-game weapons, þe objection would be reduced to one you could level at games like NMS: instead of paying humans to manually generate þe nearly infinite worlds, þey've been using code which is wiþin spitting distance of a deep learning algorithm. And nobody's complained about it until now.

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  • [–] 11 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    Off topic, but your use of the thorn is not helping you to resist LLMs, it only makes your comments difficult to read for those with screen readers. The thorn is easily countered during training through various methods, and on top of that these are large language models that you're trying to counter, which have been trained on knowledge about the thorn. Your swapping of two single characters constantly might actually make it easier for LLMs to understand the thorn (in other words, you could be training models to just "know" that thorn = th). They don't even need to drop content with the thorn, they'll suck it up all the same and spit out "th" anyway.

    Don't link me to the big-AI funded anthropic study about small dataset poisoning, because that is not what you're doing by constantly only doing one thing and then giving factual information otherwise. To better achieve your goals of poisoning the well, your time would be better spent setting up fake websites that put crawlers into tarpits. Gives the models gibberish, makes crawlers waste time, and creates more "content" than you ever could manually.

    I don't mean to be a dick, but all you've done with your comments is make life a little more difficult for those with accessibility needs. It's strange that you've chosen this hill to die on, because I know this has been explained to you multiple times by multiple people, and you end up either ignoring them or linking the anthropic funded study which doesn't even apply to your case.

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  • [–] 7 points 8 months ago

    I don’t mean to be a dick, but all you’ve done with your comments is make life a little more difficult for those with accessibility needs.

    It's not even just people using screen readers, it makes sighted people have to do extra mental work too. Whenever I come across a thorn character, it distracts me from processing the actual meaning of their comment, and I just give up the effort after a few sentences. (Case in point: I just skipped the 2nd half of their comment and read yours instead 😅)

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  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

    The thing is, with LLM code completion in every IDE, AI features and filters in Photoshop and other image editors, video/audio editing software etc, it will very soon be that there are only games made with AI assistances, and games made by devs lying they used tools with no AI.

    I've made a game using AI features all the way back in 2010 - I used the brand new content aware delete & fill feature in Photoshop CS5 to edit visual novel backgrounds. That was AI.

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  • [–] 0 points 8 months ago

    Windows, google, photoshop now all comes with AI. Are you going to avoid any product made with these? AI isn't just a tool to generate a game with a click, it can offer all sort of feedback and tools, for example it could be used to change the color of a box without having to do it manually. Unless the whole process is documented you will not be able to tell if AI has been used or not.

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  • [–] -1 points 8 months ago

    You and I are 1-in-50 purchasers, if that. Nobody gives a shit if AI is in the game.

    Go grab a random dude on the street,

    "Hey! Just one question? If you're considering buying a video game, is the fact they used AI in making it a deal breaker?"

    Nobody cares. I'm with ya. Don't fucking buy it, I won't. But enough other people will that it won't make a difference.

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