▲ 1396 ▼ Megathread: Charlie Kirk Shot at Utah Valley University Event (time.com) submitted 10 months ago by jeffw@lemmy.world [M] to c/news@lemmy.world 1498 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[+] Stamets@lemmy.world 192 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (13 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source hideshow 26 child comments replies: [–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 103 points 10 months ago (1 child) subtle small face permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] Stamets@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] Nougat@fedia.io 93 points 10 months ago (3 children) For your point 6, they will ramp it up. That's what they do. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] inclementimmigrant@lemmy.world 37 points 10 months ago Yeah, pretty much. Nazis aren't going to care about any facts here, just going to be out for "revenge" for one of their own. 2A up responsible liberals and minorities, it ain't going to be pretty. permalink fedilink source parent [–] lost@lemmy.wtf 15 points 10 months ago (3 children) Its the Reichstag fire moment they've been waiting for... permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] Nougat@fedia.io 19 points 10 months ago (1 child) Somehow I doubt Little t is going to send troops into Utah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 23 points 10 months ago No, he’ll bomb Portland because he’s literally a demented rapist. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ohulancutash@feddit.uk 9 points 10 months ago More like the killing of Horst Wessel permalink fedilink source parent [–] thoro@lemmy.ml 5 points 10 months ago* (2 children) Trump was literally shot last year. Surely that was a more fitting moment permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Captainvaqina@sh.itjust.works 17 points 10 months ago Trump says he was shot. So he wasn't actually shot. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Rothe@piefed.social 5 points 10 months ago (1 child) Trump wasn't president yet back then. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] thoro@lemmy.ml 7 points 10 months ago Why would that stop them? This fascist machine didn't just turn on. permalink fedilink source parent [–] mrgoosmoos@lemmy.ca 0 points 10 months ago and the response will need to be in kind permalink fedilink source parent [–] osaerisxero@kbin.melroy.org 26 points 10 months ago (1 child) Shot seems to have come from his right. https://media1.tenor.com/m/F4L4x85fBPAAAAAC/muttley-very-funny.gif permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] Stamets@lemmy.world 24 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 26 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (5 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 10 child comments replies: [+] Boozilla@lemmy.world 31 points 10 months ago (3 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] petrol_sniff_king@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 10 months ago so....we should be more concerned about teachers and students hurting some kids' feelings No? But it remains that the social dynamics at play make a lot of young conservatives ripe for grooming. It's kinda like being a socially awkward teen, and later becoming an Incel (capital I), and later believing that feminism is ripping society apart at its seams—there are pipelines that move people from childhood to adulthood. And sometimes these pipes stem from really simple things, like that modern city design and culture have made people really, really lonely. permalink fedilink source parent [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] Boozilla@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] Mavytan@feddit.nl -1 points 10 months ago (1 child) These emotionally damaged young men need to snap the fuck out of it and realize who is really hurting them and who really killed the American dream. That's like telling a depressed person to just be happy... "Pieces of shit like Charlie Kirk come along and" address these people's issues for better or for worse, while "some dumbass underpaid woke college professor" isn't (socially) allowed to do so or doesn't want to permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Boozilla@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago No, it's more like telling an addict to stop using. permalink fedilink source parent [–] OnlineWizard@lemmy.world 16 points 10 months ago (4 children) What the hell are u talking about? The shooter most definetly was not a piece of shit, the shooter is a hero! If someones beliefs are about opressing people and taking their rights away it's only right they are corrected or kicked the hell out of higher education. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments load more comments (4 replies) [–] Five@slrpnk.net 6 points 10 months ago (1 child) I mean, Kirk was on Gavin Newsom’s podcast in March and Newsom talked about how his kids loved Kirk. How his 13-year-old son refused to go to school because he wanted to stay home and meet Charlie. And if that doesn’t tell you how wide Kirk’s appeal is among young people I don’t know what would. And look. A lot of people on the left also discount or ignore how young conservatives feel discriminated against in higher education. Rightly or wrongly, I’m talking about their beliefs, not the validity of those beliefs. Kids who come from red states with conservative Christian beliefs about sex, about gender, about what it means to be a man, they’re proud to go to college so they can earn a better living and do better for their future children than their parents did for them. And then they hit the culture shock of college and both students and teachers are telling them “everything you believe is wrong, you’re a bad person for believing it, and if you even try to argue for it we will ostracize you”. There is no 'rightly or wrongly' -- what you're describing is indoctrination and brainwashing. They are and should be discriminated against, but not because of where they're from or the color of their skin, but because they have been taught wrong, and most importantly have been taught to see challenges to their beliefs as a threat. The purpose of a school is not to validate your pre-existing beliefs, but to give you a space to challenge your ideas and learn new ones. Ignorance should not have a safe space there, and people who do not come to learn should not feel welcome. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub -2 points 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (1 child) In a school, it should be safe to admit your ignorance. I didn't write very much, and I clearly didn't write that you shouldn't be able to admit ignorance at school. If you actually care about reading and understanding what I'm saying, then this is your opportunity to demonstrate you can roll it back, tone it down, and read what I wrote again. If some of it is ambiguous to you, you can ask me questions. It seems like you're looking for a leftist punching bag, and that will just make you look like another hateful violent right-wing brute. Are you afraid to talk about your beliefs? Are you afraid to talk about them anonymously and online? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 child) Alright. What did you mean by “ignorance should not have a safe space there”? Last week, a student at Texas A&M objected to the professor teaching about "transgenderism" in the classroom. The teacher was doing their job, teaching the scientific consensus. Instead of challenging the teacher's ideas, the student challenged the legality of teaching science. The student was ignorant. Instead of admitting ignorance, or even assuming their own competence and trying to argue their ideas, the student took the third route: threats of political violence. The student warned the teacher that police could come and force the teacher from teaching the truth. Campuses should be very intolerant to ignorance like this student displayed. But instead the teacher, department head, and dean were all penalized for standing up against an enemy of free thought. That is the goal of this administration - to force indoctrination on American children, and shut down all the spaces where having discussions like this one we're having right now might open their eyes up to the lies they've been taught. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [+] Stamets@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] Taldan@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago (3 children) You make a great point about how people feel that way, regardless of the reality. Many conservatives feel like it was illegal not to get the COVID vaccine, despite nowhere in the US having a legal requirement. It was simply businesses requiring it for their employees and/or customers To them the legal threat was very real, regardless of reality. Progressives need to understand that and work to alleviate the concerns of conservatives. We can shout all we want about how we shouldn't have to cater to them, or how basic empathy should be enough for conservatives, but that isn't the reality. If you genuinely feel immigrants are why you can't get a job, all empathy goes out the window. Telling them they're a bad person for doing something they think will help them feed their family will never work permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments load more comments (3 replies) [–] RealSpiderLane@lemmy.zip 19 points 10 months ago* (1 child) You’re not wrong; this is a tough one to comment sensibly on. The crowd thing, it’s Utah; I would anticipate a crowd at an Utah university for something like this being full of homeschooled kids who haven’t broken away from parroting their parents’ views yet. Kirk is probably a hero in many of those households. I was thinking the same thing about the angle. The tent would’ve theoretically meant the shooter would’ve had to be at a similar level/grade to make that shot. I was only able to find censored versions of the video, but it sounds like he was hit in the neck. It will be a genuine miracle if he survives. You know what’s sort of depressingly funny? The country would be better off if he were jailed for speech inciting violence. Not this. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] idiomaddict@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago You know what’s sort of depressingly funny? The country would be better off if he were jailed for speech inciting violence. Not this. Just as France would have been better off throwing Louis XVI in jail, but it was basically impossible to do. I’m very concerned about our coming reign of terror, but I didn’t realize how the tension slowly builds until you want something, anything to happen and finally move past it. Of course, a good chunk of those who died by Guillotine thought they’d be able to move past it at some point. permalink fedilink source parent [–] chocrates@piefed.world 19 points 10 months ago (1 child) Charlie Kirk is not exactly a subtle small face in all of that. 🤣😂 Agreed though everyone, even the shitheads that promotes political violence, deserve life. It's long past time that the US needs to grapple with guns and repeal the 2nd amendment permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] ssroxnak@lemmy.world 26 points 10 months ago (3 children) Right, only Trump's government should have guns. Fuck the minorities permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago Consistent gun laws is not a huge ask. It’s simple fucking common sense. And anyway what’s the worry? We built a society so slavishly devoted to guns that children are routinely mowed down by gunfire and nothing happens. Relax. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (2 replies) [–] Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works 14 points 10 months ago Looks more like a balding gray haired white guy. Which means there's a chance he'll survive to trial permalink fedilink source parent [–] amanneedsamaid@sopuli.xyz 8 points 10 months ago They'll ramp up, but they would've anyways. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Naia@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 10 months ago I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they claimed the shooter is trans. They've done it before with absolutely no evidence. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Jaysyn@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago Free conspiracy theory: It was the CIA as a distraction from the Epstein files. permalink fedilink source parent [–] teawrecks@sopuli.xyz 3 points 10 months ago And lastly, I am wondering how this is going to impact Nazis like Kirk in general. Are they going to ramp it up or step it down? There's a reason marvel used a "Hydra" as the mascot for fascism. We're still at the beginning of this roller coaster. permalink fedilink source parent [–] dil@lemmy.zip 3 points 10 months ago could be a martyr permalink fedilink source parent [–] etuomaala@sopuli.xyz 1 point 10 months ago* Re. No. 6: The fascists want violence, against them and against their enemies. They want a fight. The fascists are celebrating right now. They aren't afraid. They never were. Exactly like Hamas and Al Qaida. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 103 points 10 months ago (1 child) subtle small face permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] Stamets@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[+] Stamets@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Nougat@fedia.io 93 points 10 months ago (3 children) For your point 6, they will ramp it up. That's what they do. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] inclementimmigrant@lemmy.world 37 points 10 months ago Yeah, pretty much. Nazis aren't going to care about any facts here, just going to be out for "revenge" for one of their own. 2A up responsible liberals and minorities, it ain't going to be pretty. permalink fedilink source parent [–] lost@lemmy.wtf 15 points 10 months ago (3 children) Its the Reichstag fire moment they've been waiting for... permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] Nougat@fedia.io 19 points 10 months ago (1 child) Somehow I doubt Little t is going to send troops into Utah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 23 points 10 months ago No, he’ll bomb Portland because he’s literally a demented rapist. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ohulancutash@feddit.uk 9 points 10 months ago More like the killing of Horst Wessel permalink fedilink source parent [–] thoro@lemmy.ml 5 points 10 months ago* (2 children) Trump was literally shot last year. Surely that was a more fitting moment permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Captainvaqina@sh.itjust.works 17 points 10 months ago Trump says he was shot. So he wasn't actually shot. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Rothe@piefed.social 5 points 10 months ago (1 child) Trump wasn't president yet back then. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] thoro@lemmy.ml 7 points 10 months ago Why would that stop them? This fascist machine didn't just turn on. permalink fedilink source parent [–] mrgoosmoos@lemmy.ca 0 points 10 months ago and the response will need to be in kind permalink fedilink source parent
[–] inclementimmigrant@lemmy.world 37 points 10 months ago Yeah, pretty much. Nazis aren't going to care about any facts here, just going to be out for "revenge" for one of their own. 2A up responsible liberals and minorities, it ain't going to be pretty. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] lost@lemmy.wtf 15 points 10 months ago (3 children) Its the Reichstag fire moment they've been waiting for... permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] Nougat@fedia.io 19 points 10 months ago (1 child) Somehow I doubt Little t is going to send troops into Utah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 23 points 10 months ago No, he’ll bomb Portland because he’s literally a demented rapist. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ohulancutash@feddit.uk 9 points 10 months ago More like the killing of Horst Wessel permalink fedilink source parent [–] thoro@lemmy.ml 5 points 10 months ago* (2 children) Trump was literally shot last year. Surely that was a more fitting moment permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Captainvaqina@sh.itjust.works 17 points 10 months ago Trump says he was shot. So he wasn't actually shot. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Rothe@piefed.social 5 points 10 months ago (1 child) Trump wasn't president yet back then. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] thoro@lemmy.ml 7 points 10 months ago Why would that stop them? This fascist machine didn't just turn on. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Nougat@fedia.io 19 points 10 months ago (1 child) Somehow I doubt Little t is going to send troops into Utah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 23 points 10 months ago No, he’ll bomb Portland because he’s literally a demented rapist. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 23 points 10 months ago No, he’ll bomb Portland because he’s literally a demented rapist. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] ohulancutash@feddit.uk 9 points 10 months ago More like the killing of Horst Wessel permalink fedilink source parent
[–] thoro@lemmy.ml 5 points 10 months ago* (2 children) Trump was literally shot last year. Surely that was a more fitting moment permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Captainvaqina@sh.itjust.works 17 points 10 months ago Trump says he was shot. So he wasn't actually shot. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Rothe@piefed.social 5 points 10 months ago (1 child) Trump wasn't president yet back then. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] thoro@lemmy.ml 7 points 10 months ago Why would that stop them? This fascist machine didn't just turn on. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Captainvaqina@sh.itjust.works 17 points 10 months ago Trump says he was shot. So he wasn't actually shot. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Rothe@piefed.social 5 points 10 months ago (1 child) Trump wasn't president yet back then. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] thoro@lemmy.ml 7 points 10 months ago Why would that stop them? This fascist machine didn't just turn on. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] thoro@lemmy.ml 7 points 10 months ago Why would that stop them? This fascist machine didn't just turn on. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] mrgoosmoos@lemmy.ca 0 points 10 months ago and the response will need to be in kind permalink fedilink source parent
[–] osaerisxero@kbin.melroy.org 26 points 10 months ago (1 child) Shot seems to have come from his right. https://media1.tenor.com/m/F4L4x85fBPAAAAAC/muttley-very-funny.gif permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] Stamets@lemmy.world 24 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[+] Stamets@lemmy.world 24 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 26 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (5 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 10 child comments replies: [+] Boozilla@lemmy.world 31 points 10 months ago (3 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] petrol_sniff_king@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 10 months ago so....we should be more concerned about teachers and students hurting some kids' feelings No? But it remains that the social dynamics at play make a lot of young conservatives ripe for grooming. It's kinda like being a socially awkward teen, and later becoming an Incel (capital I), and later believing that feminism is ripping society apart at its seams—there are pipelines that move people from childhood to adulthood. And sometimes these pipes stem from really simple things, like that modern city design and culture have made people really, really lonely. permalink fedilink source parent [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] Boozilla@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] Mavytan@feddit.nl -1 points 10 months ago (1 child) These emotionally damaged young men need to snap the fuck out of it and realize who is really hurting them and who really killed the American dream. That's like telling a depressed person to just be happy... "Pieces of shit like Charlie Kirk come along and" address these people's issues for better or for worse, while "some dumbass underpaid woke college professor" isn't (socially) allowed to do so or doesn't want to permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Boozilla@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago No, it's more like telling an addict to stop using. permalink fedilink source parent [–] OnlineWizard@lemmy.world 16 points 10 months ago (4 children) What the hell are u talking about? The shooter most definetly was not a piece of shit, the shooter is a hero! If someones beliefs are about opressing people and taking their rights away it's only right they are corrected or kicked the hell out of higher education. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments load more comments (4 replies) [–] Five@slrpnk.net 6 points 10 months ago (1 child) I mean, Kirk was on Gavin Newsom’s podcast in March and Newsom talked about how his kids loved Kirk. How his 13-year-old son refused to go to school because he wanted to stay home and meet Charlie. And if that doesn’t tell you how wide Kirk’s appeal is among young people I don’t know what would. And look. A lot of people on the left also discount or ignore how young conservatives feel discriminated against in higher education. Rightly or wrongly, I’m talking about their beliefs, not the validity of those beliefs. Kids who come from red states with conservative Christian beliefs about sex, about gender, about what it means to be a man, they’re proud to go to college so they can earn a better living and do better for their future children than their parents did for them. And then they hit the culture shock of college and both students and teachers are telling them “everything you believe is wrong, you’re a bad person for believing it, and if you even try to argue for it we will ostracize you”. There is no 'rightly or wrongly' -- what you're describing is indoctrination and brainwashing. They are and should be discriminated against, but not because of where they're from or the color of their skin, but because they have been taught wrong, and most importantly have been taught to see challenges to their beliefs as a threat. The purpose of a school is not to validate your pre-existing beliefs, but to give you a space to challenge your ideas and learn new ones. Ignorance should not have a safe space there, and people who do not come to learn should not feel welcome. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub -2 points 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (1 child) In a school, it should be safe to admit your ignorance. I didn't write very much, and I clearly didn't write that you shouldn't be able to admit ignorance at school. If you actually care about reading and understanding what I'm saying, then this is your opportunity to demonstrate you can roll it back, tone it down, and read what I wrote again. If some of it is ambiguous to you, you can ask me questions. It seems like you're looking for a leftist punching bag, and that will just make you look like another hateful violent right-wing brute. Are you afraid to talk about your beliefs? Are you afraid to talk about them anonymously and online? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 child) Alright. What did you mean by “ignorance should not have a safe space there”? Last week, a student at Texas A&M objected to the professor teaching about "transgenderism" in the classroom. The teacher was doing their job, teaching the scientific consensus. Instead of challenging the teacher's ideas, the student challenged the legality of teaching science. The student was ignorant. Instead of admitting ignorance, or even assuming their own competence and trying to argue their ideas, the student took the third route: threats of political violence. The student warned the teacher that police could come and force the teacher from teaching the truth. Campuses should be very intolerant to ignorance like this student displayed. But instead the teacher, department head, and dean were all penalized for standing up against an enemy of free thought. That is the goal of this administration - to force indoctrination on American children, and shut down all the spaces where having discussions like this one we're having right now might open their eyes up to the lies they've been taught. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [+] Stamets@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] Taldan@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago (3 children) You make a great point about how people feel that way, regardless of the reality. Many conservatives feel like it was illegal not to get the COVID vaccine, despite nowhere in the US having a legal requirement. It was simply businesses requiring it for their employees and/or customers To them the legal threat was very real, regardless of reality. Progressives need to understand that and work to alleviate the concerns of conservatives. We can shout all we want about how we shouldn't have to cater to them, or how basic empathy should be enough for conservatives, but that isn't the reality. If you genuinely feel immigrants are why you can't get a job, all empathy goes out the window. Telling them they're a bad person for doing something they think will help them feed their family will never work permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments load more comments (3 replies)
[+] Boozilla@lemmy.world 31 points 10 months ago (3 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] petrol_sniff_king@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 10 months ago so....we should be more concerned about teachers and students hurting some kids' feelings No? But it remains that the social dynamics at play make a lot of young conservatives ripe for grooming. It's kinda like being a socially awkward teen, and later becoming an Incel (capital I), and later believing that feminism is ripping society apart at its seams—there are pipelines that move people from childhood to adulthood. And sometimes these pipes stem from really simple things, like that modern city design and culture have made people really, really lonely. permalink fedilink source parent [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] Boozilla@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] Mavytan@feddit.nl -1 points 10 months ago (1 child) These emotionally damaged young men need to snap the fuck out of it and realize who is really hurting them and who really killed the American dream. That's like telling a depressed person to just be happy... "Pieces of shit like Charlie Kirk come along and" address these people's issues for better or for worse, while "some dumbass underpaid woke college professor" isn't (socially) allowed to do so or doesn't want to permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Boozilla@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago No, it's more like telling an addict to stop using. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] petrol_sniff_king@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 10 months ago so....we should be more concerned about teachers and students hurting some kids' feelings No? But it remains that the social dynamics at play make a lot of young conservatives ripe for grooming. It's kinda like being a socially awkward teen, and later becoming an Incel (capital I), and later believing that feminism is ripping society apart at its seams—there are pipelines that move people from childhood to adulthood. And sometimes these pipes stem from really simple things, like that modern city design and culture have made people really, really lonely. permalink fedilink source parent
[+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] Boozilla@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Mavytan@feddit.nl -1 points 10 months ago (1 child) These emotionally damaged young men need to snap the fuck out of it and realize who is really hurting them and who really killed the American dream. That's like telling a depressed person to just be happy... "Pieces of shit like Charlie Kirk come along and" address these people's issues for better or for worse, while "some dumbass underpaid woke college professor" isn't (socially) allowed to do so or doesn't want to permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Boozilla@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago No, it's more like telling an addict to stop using. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Boozilla@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago No, it's more like telling an addict to stop using. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] OnlineWizard@lemmy.world 16 points 10 months ago (4 children) What the hell are u talking about? The shooter most definetly was not a piece of shit, the shooter is a hero! If someones beliefs are about opressing people and taking their rights away it's only right they are corrected or kicked the hell out of higher education. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments load more comments (4 replies)
[–] Five@slrpnk.net 6 points 10 months ago (1 child) I mean, Kirk was on Gavin Newsom’s podcast in March and Newsom talked about how his kids loved Kirk. How his 13-year-old son refused to go to school because he wanted to stay home and meet Charlie. And if that doesn’t tell you how wide Kirk’s appeal is among young people I don’t know what would. And look. A lot of people on the left also discount or ignore how young conservatives feel discriminated against in higher education. Rightly or wrongly, I’m talking about their beliefs, not the validity of those beliefs. Kids who come from red states with conservative Christian beliefs about sex, about gender, about what it means to be a man, they’re proud to go to college so they can earn a better living and do better for their future children than their parents did for them. And then they hit the culture shock of college and both students and teachers are telling them “everything you believe is wrong, you’re a bad person for believing it, and if you even try to argue for it we will ostracize you”. There is no 'rightly or wrongly' -- what you're describing is indoctrination and brainwashing. They are and should be discriminated against, but not because of where they're from or the color of their skin, but because they have been taught wrong, and most importantly have been taught to see challenges to their beliefs as a threat. The purpose of a school is not to validate your pre-existing beliefs, but to give you a space to challenge your ideas and learn new ones. Ignorance should not have a safe space there, and people who do not come to learn should not feel welcome. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub -2 points 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (1 child) In a school, it should be safe to admit your ignorance. I didn't write very much, and I clearly didn't write that you shouldn't be able to admit ignorance at school. If you actually care about reading and understanding what I'm saying, then this is your opportunity to demonstrate you can roll it back, tone it down, and read what I wrote again. If some of it is ambiguous to you, you can ask me questions. It seems like you're looking for a leftist punching bag, and that will just make you look like another hateful violent right-wing brute. Are you afraid to talk about your beliefs? Are you afraid to talk about them anonymously and online? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 child) Alright. What did you mean by “ignorance should not have a safe space there”? Last week, a student at Texas A&M objected to the professor teaching about "transgenderism" in the classroom. The teacher was doing their job, teaching the scientific consensus. Instead of challenging the teacher's ideas, the student challenged the legality of teaching science. The student was ignorant. Instead of admitting ignorance, or even assuming their own competence and trying to argue their ideas, the student took the third route: threats of political violence. The student warned the teacher that police could come and force the teacher from teaching the truth. Campuses should be very intolerant to ignorance like this student displayed. But instead the teacher, department head, and dean were all penalized for standing up against an enemy of free thought. That is the goal of this administration - to force indoctrination on American children, and shut down all the spaces where having discussions like this one we're having right now might open their eyes up to the lies they've been taught. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub -2 points 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (1 child) In a school, it should be safe to admit your ignorance. I didn't write very much, and I clearly didn't write that you shouldn't be able to admit ignorance at school. If you actually care about reading and understanding what I'm saying, then this is your opportunity to demonstrate you can roll it back, tone it down, and read what I wrote again. If some of it is ambiguous to you, you can ask me questions. It seems like you're looking for a leftist punching bag, and that will just make you look like another hateful violent right-wing brute. Are you afraid to talk about your beliefs? Are you afraid to talk about them anonymously and online? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 child) Alright. What did you mean by “ignorance should not have a safe space there”? Last week, a student at Texas A&M objected to the professor teaching about "transgenderism" in the classroom. The teacher was doing their job, teaching the scientific consensus. Instead of challenging the teacher's ideas, the student challenged the legality of teaching science. The student was ignorant. Instead of admitting ignorance, or even assuming their own competence and trying to argue their ideas, the student took the third route: threats of political violence. The student warned the teacher that police could come and force the teacher from teaching the truth. Campuses should be very intolerant to ignorance like this student displayed. But instead the teacher, department head, and dean were all penalized for standing up against an enemy of free thought. That is the goal of this administration - to force indoctrination on American children, and shut down all the spaces where having discussions like this one we're having right now might open their eyes up to the lies they've been taught. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (1 child) In a school, it should be safe to admit your ignorance. I didn't write very much, and I clearly didn't write that you shouldn't be able to admit ignorance at school. If you actually care about reading and understanding what I'm saying, then this is your opportunity to demonstrate you can roll it back, tone it down, and read what I wrote again. If some of it is ambiguous to you, you can ask me questions. It seems like you're looking for a leftist punching bag, and that will just make you look like another hateful violent right-wing brute. Are you afraid to talk about your beliefs? Are you afraid to talk about them anonymously and online? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 child) Alright. What did you mean by “ignorance should not have a safe space there”? Last week, a student at Texas A&M objected to the professor teaching about "transgenderism" in the classroom. The teacher was doing their job, teaching the scientific consensus. Instead of challenging the teacher's ideas, the student challenged the legality of teaching science. The student was ignorant. Instead of admitting ignorance, or even assuming their own competence and trying to argue their ideas, the student took the third route: threats of political violence. The student warned the teacher that police could come and force the teacher from teaching the truth. Campuses should be very intolerant to ignorance like this student displayed. But instead the teacher, department head, and dean were all penalized for standing up against an enemy of free thought. That is the goal of this administration - to force indoctrination on American children, and shut down all the spaces where having discussions like this one we're having right now might open their eyes up to the lies they've been taught. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 child) Alright. What did you mean by “ignorance should not have a safe space there”? Last week, a student at Texas A&M objected to the professor teaching about "transgenderism" in the classroom. The teacher was doing their job, teaching the scientific consensus. Instead of challenging the teacher's ideas, the student challenged the legality of teaching science. The student was ignorant. Instead of admitting ignorance, or even assuming their own competence and trying to argue their ideas, the student took the third route: threats of political violence. The student warned the teacher that police could come and force the teacher from teaching the truth. Campuses should be very intolerant to ignorance like this student displayed. But instead the teacher, department head, and dean were all penalized for standing up against an enemy of free thought. That is the goal of this administration - to force indoctrination on American children, and shut down all the spaces where having discussions like this one we're having right now might open their eyes up to the lies they've been taught. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Five@slrpnk.net 1 point 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 child) Alright. What did you mean by “ignorance should not have a safe space there”? Last week, a student at Texas A&M objected to the professor teaching about "transgenderism" in the classroom. The teacher was doing their job, teaching the scientific consensus. Instead of challenging the teacher's ideas, the student challenged the legality of teaching science. The student was ignorant. Instead of admitting ignorance, or even assuming their own competence and trying to argue their ideas, the student took the third route: threats of political violence. The student warned the teacher that police could come and force the teacher from teaching the truth. Campuses should be very intolerant to ignorance like this student displayed. But instead the teacher, department head, and dean were all penalized for standing up against an enemy of free thought. That is the goal of this administration - to force indoctrination on American children, and shut down all the spaces where having discussions like this one we're having right now might open their eyes up to the lies they've been taught. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sleepundertheleaves@infosec.pub 1 point 10 months ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[+] Stamets@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Taldan@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago (3 children) You make a great point about how people feel that way, regardless of the reality. Many conservatives feel like it was illegal not to get the COVID vaccine, despite nowhere in the US having a legal requirement. It was simply businesses requiring it for their employees and/or customers To them the legal threat was very real, regardless of reality. Progressives need to understand that and work to alleviate the concerns of conservatives. We can shout all we want about how we shouldn't have to cater to them, or how basic empathy should be enough for conservatives, but that isn't the reality. If you genuinely feel immigrants are why you can't get a job, all empathy goes out the window. Telling them they're a bad person for doing something they think will help them feed their family will never work permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments load more comments (3 replies)
[–] RealSpiderLane@lemmy.zip 19 points 10 months ago* (1 child) You’re not wrong; this is a tough one to comment sensibly on. The crowd thing, it’s Utah; I would anticipate a crowd at an Utah university for something like this being full of homeschooled kids who haven’t broken away from parroting their parents’ views yet. Kirk is probably a hero in many of those households. I was thinking the same thing about the angle. The tent would’ve theoretically meant the shooter would’ve had to be at a similar level/grade to make that shot. I was only able to find censored versions of the video, but it sounds like he was hit in the neck. It will be a genuine miracle if he survives. You know what’s sort of depressingly funny? The country would be better off if he were jailed for speech inciting violence. Not this. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] idiomaddict@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago You know what’s sort of depressingly funny? The country would be better off if he were jailed for speech inciting violence. Not this. Just as France would have been better off throwing Louis XVI in jail, but it was basically impossible to do. I’m very concerned about our coming reign of terror, but I didn’t realize how the tension slowly builds until you want something, anything to happen and finally move past it. Of course, a good chunk of those who died by Guillotine thought they’d be able to move past it at some point. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] idiomaddict@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago You know what’s sort of depressingly funny? The country would be better off if he were jailed for speech inciting violence. Not this. Just as France would have been better off throwing Louis XVI in jail, but it was basically impossible to do. I’m very concerned about our coming reign of terror, but I didn’t realize how the tension slowly builds until you want something, anything to happen and finally move past it. Of course, a good chunk of those who died by Guillotine thought they’d be able to move past it at some point. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] chocrates@piefed.world 19 points 10 months ago (1 child) Charlie Kirk is not exactly a subtle small face in all of that. 🤣😂 Agreed though everyone, even the shitheads that promotes political violence, deserve life. It's long past time that the US needs to grapple with guns and repeal the 2nd amendment permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] ssroxnak@lemmy.world 26 points 10 months ago (3 children) Right, only Trump's government should have guns. Fuck the minorities permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago Consistent gun laws is not a huge ask. It’s simple fucking common sense. And anyway what’s the worry? We built a society so slavishly devoted to guns that children are routinely mowed down by gunfire and nothing happens. Relax. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (2 replies)
[–] ssroxnak@lemmy.world 26 points 10 months ago (3 children) Right, only Trump's government should have guns. Fuck the minorities permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago Consistent gun laws is not a huge ask. It’s simple fucking common sense. And anyway what’s the worry? We built a society so slavishly devoted to guns that children are routinely mowed down by gunfire and nothing happens. Relax. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (2 replies)
[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago Consistent gun laws is not a huge ask. It’s simple fucking common sense. And anyway what’s the worry? We built a society so slavishly devoted to guns that children are routinely mowed down by gunfire and nothing happens. Relax. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works 14 points 10 months ago Looks more like a balding gray haired white guy. Which means there's a chance he'll survive to trial permalink fedilink source parent
[–] amanneedsamaid@sopuli.xyz 8 points 10 months ago They'll ramp up, but they would've anyways. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Naia@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 10 months ago I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they claimed the shooter is trans. They've done it before with absolutely no evidence. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Jaysyn@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago Free conspiracy theory: It was the CIA as a distraction from the Epstein files. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] teawrecks@sopuli.xyz 3 points 10 months ago And lastly, I am wondering how this is going to impact Nazis like Kirk in general. Are they going to ramp it up or step it down? There's a reason marvel used a "Hydra" as the mascot for fascism. We're still at the beginning of this roller coaster. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] etuomaala@sopuli.xyz 1 point 10 months ago* Re. No. 6: The fascists want violence, against them and against their enemies. They want a fight. The fascists are celebrating right now. They aren't afraid. They never were. Exactly like Hamas and Al Qaida. permalink fedilink source parent