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Some of y'all are not ready to hear this... (lemmy.world)
submitted 1 year ago by to c/politicalmemes@lemmy.world
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[–] -2 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

I am actively engaging in a political party that seeks a departure from the US and NATO. It uses populist policies to polarize and at the same time weakens the far right by drawing from their ranks with said populist rhetoric and policies.

We are doing what we can, but to topple any government, conditions first have to worsen. As I've said before the best we can basically do is stoke the flames until the right conditions arise for real change.

My issue is not with people trying to act. It's with people who act wrong either out of malice or just ignorance. That is what reform is. Capitalism has never been overthrown via reform and never will be now. Liberals are too brainwashed to realise that capitalism needs to be overthrown for any meaningful lasting change, so instead they act to feed it, thinking they can reform it into being good. Something which is not possible, as it goes against it's structure and ideals.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    That would be accelerationism. The attached link might not completely match your views, but what you described aligns with it.

    I was considering adopting this ideology during the presidential election and either voting for trump or not at all, but I decided against it. Adopting this view means you are discounting the sheer amount of human suffering that would be involved in the process because, "The ends justify the means."

    Yes there is suffering right now, I am not discounting that. If you care about people, I would recommend taking the slow route of reform that will get us to a better place with enough time and effort.

    You cannot deny that progress has been made over the last 100 years. It may not be much, but life is much better than it used to be for a lot of people. Not to say life is good, just to say we have been SLOWLY stepping forward.

    https://pols.sites.haverford.edu/studentvoices/what-is-accelerationism/

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I do subscribe to accelerationism.

    The fact of the matter is that humans will suffer and die, no matter what you do.

    Accelerating will kill and harm less people in the long run. It's a simple math equation of having more people suffer now for a shorter amount of time vs having people suffer and die until the end of time. Accelerationism will cause less suffering after a certain amount of time. It could be as a little as a decade of lasting capitalism causing the same amount of suffering and death as a accelerating the collapse of capitalism.

    And yes progress has been made, but it is not a law of nature. We have also regressed again over the past century. Currently we're sliding back with the collapse of the Soviet Union and humanity failing to advance past capitalism. Technological progress will keep increasing quality of life to a point, but on a societal level we've been regressing since the 90s.

    Saying reform will get us to a better place is a questionable argument. Historically reform has not achieved nearly as much as revolution. Reform let to Nazi dictatorship in Germany and in general the rise of fascism (as it might soon once again). Not a single time has socialism been established via reform. The one time it was attempted peacefully was in Chile. The response was a coup from an unpurged military and sympathisers in unpurged institutions with support from the CIA.

    Meanwhile revolution dragged Russia from an unindustrialised backwater to a nation running one of the first space programs in the world within only 40 years. Likewise the French revolution led to the spread of liberalism and republicanism throughout the western world. It is the single most important reason why we live in the world we do today and not one of absolutism. Revolution is why the USA is an independent nation and not a colony anymore.

    Do you think those would have been achieved with reform? If yes, do you think how much longer this would have taken and how many more would have continued suffering during this time would be worth it?

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    Both reform and "revolution" have their risks.

    With reform, you are betting on a slow fight with less suffering and slow progress.

    -Risk: Constant pressure from the right/ruling class will overwhelm any progress made.

    With "revolution" you are wagering that a major amount of suffering will result in faster progress.

    -Risk: Uncertainty. You cannot guarantee that the "good guys" will come out on top. And that is assuming America is operating in a vacuum. There are major superpowers who would absolutely love to take the land and resources we have. As well as others who would love to get a blow in for the suffering we have inflicted on them.

    I am going to hold out hope for reform until USA's Zohran Mamdani Arc is over. If he is elected and able to reform NY, I will be staying on the reform side, since that will prove it is possible with enough time and effort.

    Thank you for having this conversation and being willing to continue it.

    I would caution you about your wording when discussing this in the future because phrasing mass suffering as, "a simple math equation" sounds horribly callous.

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  • [–] -1 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I am actively engaging in a political party that seeks a departure from the US and NATO.

    Lol. Of course you are.

    capitalism needs to be overthrown

    I'll wait for you to explain what it will be replaced with and how that will work. I'm not exactly in love with capitalism, but I think a heavily regulated capitalism is the best we can do at this point in human history.

    You sound like a Libertarian. Grand ideals. No follow through.

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