▲ 896 ▼ Some of y'all are not ready to hear this... (lemmy.world) submitted 1 year ago by return2ozma@lemmy.world to c/politicalmemes@lemmy.world 405 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[–] Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world 82 points 1 year ago (12 children) Roosevelt did great things for Americans while still being capitalist. The needle can be moved left without violent revolution. "Both sides bad" is weak sauce. permalink fedilink source hideshow 24 child comments replies: [–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 106 points 1 year ago (5 children) Quick reminder that there were other things going on in the 20s and 30s. You know, the height of socialism in the West, a strong labor movement willing to burn down factories, stuff like that. The New Deal didn't come because leftists played nice. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 10 child comments replies: [–] SinAdjetivos@lemmy.world 23 points 1 year ago The coal wars threatening to kick off a second civil war, y'know small things. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago Blue Morpho apparently never learned about the Battle of Blair Mountain or the Railway Strikes. permalink fedilink source parent [–] slackassassin@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 year ago (1 child) So there ARE conditions by which reform can occur, neat. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 4 points 1 year ago Yes, but you have to be willing to crack bourgeoisie skulls. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Oneshot@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 1 year ago A socialist movement independent from either of the major parties too! permalink fedilink source parent [–] Yppm@lemy.lol 1 point 1 year ago (1 child) I feel like Western labour just doesn't have any leverage anymore. The rich simply do not need us. They have outsourced enough labour that they really don't care if we strike en masse. Like, shut down which factories? They're all overseas. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 2 points 1 year ago That's what they want you to think. Their own lives depend on Western labor. That's who runs the ports, the railways, the warehouses, etc. Also a lot of high-tech stuff is still in the West. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Mustakrakish@lemmy.world 54 points 1 year ago No, the new deal only came to be after violent protests, and was largely a betrayal of labor groups because it gave a much watered down version of what was actually demanded, all while Roosevelt broke the strike he promised to support while campaigning. Read "Labor's Giant Step Forward" by Art Preis if you want a more detailed accpunt permalink fedilink source parent [–] njm1314@lemmy.world 29 points 1 year ago (1 child) In addition to the points raised by some of the other comments I'd remind you of one uncomfortable truth. The business plot was attempted fascist takeover of America. That was thankfully put down because remarkably there was one honorable ex-marine they tried to involve the plot. That's Smedley Butler. In the wake of that that attempted fascist coup basically nobody was punished. In large part because Roosevelt told them as long as they kept their mouth shut and didn't block the New Deal he wouldn't go after them. That's basically the only reason it got through. Truncated as it was even then. Because most of the richest and most powerful people in the country we're looking down the barrel of a gun otherwise. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dethedrus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 year ago Prescott Bush and his cronies should have been hanged. And Smedley Butler Day should be a national holiday. permalink fedilink source parent [–] blindbunny@lemmy.ml 23 points 1 year ago (1 child) Have fun wasting your time doing this. If they only fucked over Burnie once I might agree with you. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Korne127@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago Well, they will still try. They won't give it up. But it's not possible to win it against them, like the Tea Party won against less extreme establishment Republicans permalink fedilink source parent [–] missingno@fedia.io 18 points 1 year ago If you had to go back almost a hundred years to find any kind of example, I'm just going to gesture broadly at the next hundred years and rest my case. permalink fedilink source parent [–] flandish@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago can it be done again without another series of protests and pain the current era of capitalism? permalink fedilink source parent [–] RedPandaRaider@feddit.org 7 points 1 year ago (1 child) Roosevelt was the least bad president and was ruling during a time where the US ended up on the right side of a conflict. He still did not abolish capitalism or the American empire, nor did he have any intentions to. But that doesn't make the democrats good, it doesn't make one side better, it doesn't make the US good. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago* it doesn’t make one side better One side IS objectively better. That's proven by economic stats. That's proven by voting history. That's proven by criminal conviction history. There is no debate which side is better if you're even remotely interested in facts. You take the side that is better and you reform it by primarying the reps that won't play ball for their constituents., sending a clear message to the reps that remain. That is how democracy works in its most effective form. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Allonzee@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child) Both sides are varying degrees of the same ideology, give all the money to the economic elite so they bribe both parties into maintaining that policy above all other considerations. One side shrugs and calls it free market forces(D) as you suffer under that policy goal, the other points and laughs at you and says you deserve it(R). That is the extent of our "freedom" under American democracy. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] svtdragon@lemmy.world 1 point 1 year ago One side appoints Justices that voted against Citizens United and one appoints Justices that voted for it. That's a huge distinction. permalink fedilink source parent [–] brachiosaurus@mander.xyz 1 point 1 year ago With unintelligent comments like yours and all the discussions happening below meme threads, conflicts and violence is where we are heading to. I encourage you to learn more about the things you are talking about. permalink fedilink source parent [–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 year ago (1 child) Both sides are functionally the same when it comes to the world. There's barely a difference between domestic policy between the two American parties. One uses sweet nothing's to try assuage your fears and the other uses Force and strongman techniques. Yeah the FDR Reformation came directly from FDR and we pushed through at his behest. According to my understanding of these politics at a time if The president hadn't been FDR we would not have gotten those Reformations. Besides they hardly matter nowadays when they're practically entirely Stripped Away. The last surviving one is social security and they're pretty gung-ho about getting rid of that too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (1 child) Both sides Instant downvote. Lazy trash. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 year ago* (1 child) Couldn't be bothered to read. Ad hominem attack. Excellent representation of the American voter. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (1 child) People who type the words "both sides" and then post don't deserve to have their comments read. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago* People who are unable to read are one of the reason the United States is in the toilet. People who use fallacies so they don't have to engage with the objective facts of an argument they're not able to impeach are another reason the world is falling to facism permalink fedilink source parent [+] nomoretrdsssss@lemmings.world -2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) [removed by mod] permalink fedilink source parent [–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago Yep. All the keyboard warriors talking about revolution need to either pick up and gun and do it or get off their asses and help primary bad Dems to send a message and start the reformation process. No one who made it out of high school should be saying "both sides" because it's a profoundly stupid and unproductive thing to say. Did we have masked squads disappearing people before January? Did our allies all hate us? Were we threatening fucking Canada? Were we paying tariff taxes? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 106 points 1 year ago (5 children) Quick reminder that there were other things going on in the 20s and 30s. You know, the height of socialism in the West, a strong labor movement willing to burn down factories, stuff like that. The New Deal didn't come because leftists played nice. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 10 child comments replies: [–] SinAdjetivos@lemmy.world 23 points 1 year ago The coal wars threatening to kick off a second civil war, y'know small things. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago Blue Morpho apparently never learned about the Battle of Blair Mountain or the Railway Strikes. permalink fedilink source parent [–] slackassassin@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 year ago (1 child) So there ARE conditions by which reform can occur, neat. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 4 points 1 year ago Yes, but you have to be willing to crack bourgeoisie skulls. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Oneshot@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 1 year ago A socialist movement independent from either of the major parties too! permalink fedilink source parent [–] Yppm@lemy.lol 1 point 1 year ago (1 child) I feel like Western labour just doesn't have any leverage anymore. The rich simply do not need us. They have outsourced enough labour that they really don't care if we strike en masse. Like, shut down which factories? They're all overseas. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 2 points 1 year ago That's what they want you to think. Their own lives depend on Western labor. That's who runs the ports, the railways, the warehouses, etc. Also a lot of high-tech stuff is still in the West. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] SinAdjetivos@lemmy.world 23 points 1 year ago The coal wars threatening to kick off a second civil war, y'know small things. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago Blue Morpho apparently never learned about the Battle of Blair Mountain or the Railway Strikes. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] slackassassin@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 year ago (1 child) So there ARE conditions by which reform can occur, neat. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 4 points 1 year ago Yes, but you have to be willing to crack bourgeoisie skulls. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 4 points 1 year ago Yes, but you have to be willing to crack bourgeoisie skulls. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Oneshot@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 1 year ago A socialist movement independent from either of the major parties too! permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Yppm@lemy.lol 1 point 1 year ago (1 child) I feel like Western labour just doesn't have any leverage anymore. The rich simply do not need us. They have outsourced enough labour that they really don't care if we strike en masse. Like, shut down which factories? They're all overseas. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 2 points 1 year ago That's what they want you to think. Their own lives depend on Western labor. That's who runs the ports, the railways, the warehouses, etc. Also a lot of high-tech stuff is still in the West. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 2 points 1 year ago That's what they want you to think. Their own lives depend on Western labor. That's who runs the ports, the railways, the warehouses, etc. Also a lot of high-tech stuff is still in the West. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Mustakrakish@lemmy.world 54 points 1 year ago No, the new deal only came to be after violent protests, and was largely a betrayal of labor groups because it gave a much watered down version of what was actually demanded, all while Roosevelt broke the strike he promised to support while campaigning. Read "Labor's Giant Step Forward" by Art Preis if you want a more detailed accpunt permalink fedilink source parent
[–] njm1314@lemmy.world 29 points 1 year ago (1 child) In addition to the points raised by some of the other comments I'd remind you of one uncomfortable truth. The business plot was attempted fascist takeover of America. That was thankfully put down because remarkably there was one honorable ex-marine they tried to involve the plot. That's Smedley Butler. In the wake of that that attempted fascist coup basically nobody was punished. In large part because Roosevelt told them as long as they kept their mouth shut and didn't block the New Deal he wouldn't go after them. That's basically the only reason it got through. Truncated as it was even then. Because most of the richest and most powerful people in the country we're looking down the barrel of a gun otherwise. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dethedrus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 year ago Prescott Bush and his cronies should have been hanged. And Smedley Butler Day should be a national holiday. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] dethedrus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 year ago Prescott Bush and his cronies should have been hanged. And Smedley Butler Day should be a national holiday. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] blindbunny@lemmy.ml 23 points 1 year ago (1 child) Have fun wasting your time doing this. If they only fucked over Burnie once I might agree with you. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Korne127@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago Well, they will still try. They won't give it up. But it's not possible to win it against them, like the Tea Party won against less extreme establishment Republicans permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Korne127@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago Well, they will still try. They won't give it up. But it's not possible to win it against them, like the Tea Party won against less extreme establishment Republicans permalink fedilink source parent
[–] missingno@fedia.io 18 points 1 year ago If you had to go back almost a hundred years to find any kind of example, I'm just going to gesture broadly at the next hundred years and rest my case. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] flandish@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago can it be done again without another series of protests and pain the current era of capitalism? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] RedPandaRaider@feddit.org 7 points 1 year ago (1 child) Roosevelt was the least bad president and was ruling during a time where the US ended up on the right side of a conflict. He still did not abolish capitalism or the American empire, nor did he have any intentions to. But that doesn't make the democrats good, it doesn't make one side better, it doesn't make the US good. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago* it doesn’t make one side better One side IS objectively better. That's proven by economic stats. That's proven by voting history. That's proven by criminal conviction history. There is no debate which side is better if you're even remotely interested in facts. You take the side that is better and you reform it by primarying the reps that won't play ball for their constituents., sending a clear message to the reps that remain. That is how democracy works in its most effective form. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago* it doesn’t make one side better One side IS objectively better. That's proven by economic stats. That's proven by voting history. That's proven by criminal conviction history. There is no debate which side is better if you're even remotely interested in facts. You take the side that is better and you reform it by primarying the reps that won't play ball for their constituents., sending a clear message to the reps that remain. That is how democracy works in its most effective form. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Allonzee@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child) Both sides are varying degrees of the same ideology, give all the money to the economic elite so they bribe both parties into maintaining that policy above all other considerations. One side shrugs and calls it free market forces(D) as you suffer under that policy goal, the other points and laughs at you and says you deserve it(R). That is the extent of our "freedom" under American democracy. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] svtdragon@lemmy.world 1 point 1 year ago One side appoints Justices that voted against Citizens United and one appoints Justices that voted for it. That's a huge distinction. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] svtdragon@lemmy.world 1 point 1 year ago One side appoints Justices that voted against Citizens United and one appoints Justices that voted for it. That's a huge distinction. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] brachiosaurus@mander.xyz 1 point 1 year ago With unintelligent comments like yours and all the discussions happening below meme threads, conflicts and violence is where we are heading to. I encourage you to learn more about the things you are talking about. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 year ago (1 child) Both sides are functionally the same when it comes to the world. There's barely a difference between domestic policy between the two American parties. One uses sweet nothing's to try assuage your fears and the other uses Force and strongman techniques. Yeah the FDR Reformation came directly from FDR and we pushed through at his behest. According to my understanding of these politics at a time if The president hadn't been FDR we would not have gotten those Reformations. Besides they hardly matter nowadays when they're practically entirely Stripped Away. The last surviving one is social security and they're pretty gung-ho about getting rid of that too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (1 child) Both sides Instant downvote. Lazy trash. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 year ago* (1 child) Couldn't be bothered to read. Ad hominem attack. Excellent representation of the American voter. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (1 child) People who type the words "both sides" and then post don't deserve to have their comments read. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago* People who are unable to read are one of the reason the United States is in the toilet. People who use fallacies so they don't have to engage with the objective facts of an argument they're not able to impeach are another reason the world is falling to facism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (1 child) Both sides Instant downvote. Lazy trash. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 year ago* (1 child) Couldn't be bothered to read. Ad hominem attack. Excellent representation of the American voter. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (1 child) People who type the words "both sides" and then post don't deserve to have their comments read. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago* People who are unable to read are one of the reason the United States is in the toilet. People who use fallacies so they don't have to engage with the objective facts of an argument they're not able to impeach are another reason the world is falling to facism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 year ago* (1 child) Couldn't be bothered to read. Ad hominem attack. Excellent representation of the American voter. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (1 child) People who type the words "both sides" and then post don't deserve to have their comments read. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago* People who are unable to read are one of the reason the United States is in the toilet. People who use fallacies so they don't have to engage with the objective facts of an argument they're not able to impeach are another reason the world is falling to facism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (1 child) People who type the words "both sides" and then post don't deserve to have their comments read. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago* People who are unable to read are one of the reason the United States is in the toilet. People who use fallacies so they don't have to engage with the objective facts of an argument they're not able to impeach are another reason the world is falling to facism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] dastanktal@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago* People who are unable to read are one of the reason the United States is in the toilet. People who use fallacies so they don't have to engage with the objective facts of an argument they're not able to impeach are another reason the world is falling to facism permalink fedilink source parent
[+] nomoretrdsssss@lemmings.world -2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) [removed by mod] permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago Yep. All the keyboard warriors talking about revolution need to either pick up and gun and do it or get off their asses and help primary bad Dems to send a message and start the reformation process. No one who made it out of high school should be saying "both sides" because it's a profoundly stupid and unproductive thing to say. Did we have masked squads disappearing people before January? Did our allies all hate us? Were we threatening fucking Canada? Were we paying tariff taxes? permalink fedilink source parent