▲ 88 ▼ Late Stage Capitalism is when Finland bans symbols of communism. 'It's always East Europe against Communist Symbols', 'Banning the communist symbol makes you a nazi.', (sh.itjust.works) submitted 2 years ago by goat@sh.itjust.works [M] to c/meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works 60 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 13 points 2 years ago* (1 child) The Soviet Union's propaganda and culture tick all of those, though. But fair, I typically use authoritarian anyway. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 5 points 2 years ago (3 children) I do not think so. There was no “return to the good old days” in USSR at all. The ideology, while was stressing the importance to defend itself, did not fetishized the military. Nationalism was also missing. And instead there was class fight, common means of production, etc. It was quite different. The only common part was the authoritarian government and the principle that the state is greater than individual. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 6 points 2 years ago (1 child) USSR didn't fetishize the military? Are you high? Can I have some? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) I lived there. No, military was not fetishized. Most of the people would not want to go and serve. The draft was something to avoid if you can. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) You lived there? How old are you? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) 50+. Do not want to give personal information on internet more than needed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) So you didn't actually experience life under the soviet gulags. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) I did not claimed I am. But Soviet ideology and fascist ideology are quite different. It is not like there must be just single ideology that can do bad things. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Authoritarianism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Akagigahara@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago There was the idea of bringing the revolution to others. While mostly after Stalin, the USSR heavily engaged in combat to exert its influence. The Korean and Vietnamese Civil Wars were proxy wars in which both the US and the USSR were engaged in. Then there was the soviet invasion of Afghanistan, too. Their propaganda has a lot of hints of glorifying the military, sacrifice and fanaticism. permalink fedilink source parent [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (2 children) Isn't doing things for the sake of the state nationalism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago You do not do that for the sake of state. You do that for the collective. State is just bureaucratic representation of that. In fascist Germany you would do that for the Germany and German nation specifically. In USSR you do not do that for USSR or USSR nation (there was no such thing). permalink fedilink source parent [–] PugJesus@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago Generally that's regarded as civic nationalism ("People are bound together by a common government"), whereas most people think of ethnic nationalism ("People are bound together by common descent or culture") when they speak of nationalism. Though there is a strong argument to be made for the SovUnion being an extension of Russian domination over other ethnicities, just like the Russian Empire which preceded it. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] MxM111@kbin.social 5 points 2 years ago (3 children) I do not think so. There was no “return to the good old days” in USSR at all. The ideology, while was stressing the importance to defend itself, did not fetishized the military. Nationalism was also missing. And instead there was class fight, common means of production, etc. It was quite different. The only common part was the authoritarian government and the principle that the state is greater than individual. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 6 points 2 years ago (1 child) USSR didn't fetishize the military? Are you high? Can I have some? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) I lived there. No, military was not fetishized. Most of the people would not want to go and serve. The draft was something to avoid if you can. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) You lived there? How old are you? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) 50+. Do not want to give personal information on internet more than needed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) So you didn't actually experience life under the soviet gulags. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) I did not claimed I am. But Soviet ideology and fascist ideology are quite different. It is not like there must be just single ideology that can do bad things. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Authoritarianism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Akagigahara@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago There was the idea of bringing the revolution to others. While mostly after Stalin, the USSR heavily engaged in combat to exert its influence. The Korean and Vietnamese Civil Wars were proxy wars in which both the US and the USSR were engaged in. Then there was the soviet invasion of Afghanistan, too. Their propaganda has a lot of hints of glorifying the military, sacrifice and fanaticism. permalink fedilink source parent [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (2 children) Isn't doing things for the sake of the state nationalism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago You do not do that for the sake of state. You do that for the collective. State is just bureaucratic representation of that. In fascist Germany you would do that for the Germany and German nation specifically. In USSR you do not do that for USSR or USSR nation (there was no such thing). permalink fedilink source parent [–] PugJesus@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago Generally that's regarded as civic nationalism ("People are bound together by a common government"), whereas most people think of ethnic nationalism ("People are bound together by common descent or culture") when they speak of nationalism. Though there is a strong argument to be made for the SovUnion being an extension of Russian domination over other ethnicities, just like the Russian Empire which preceded it. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 6 points 2 years ago (1 child) USSR didn't fetishize the military? Are you high? Can I have some? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) I lived there. No, military was not fetishized. Most of the people would not want to go and serve. The draft was something to avoid if you can. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) You lived there? How old are you? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) 50+. Do not want to give personal information on internet more than needed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) So you didn't actually experience life under the soviet gulags. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) I did not claimed I am. But Soviet ideology and fascist ideology are quite different. It is not like there must be just single ideology that can do bad things. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Authoritarianism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) I lived there. No, military was not fetishized. Most of the people would not want to go and serve. The draft was something to avoid if you can. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) You lived there? How old are you? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) 50+. Do not want to give personal information on internet more than needed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) So you didn't actually experience life under the soviet gulags. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) I did not claimed I am. But Soviet ideology and fascist ideology are quite different. It is not like there must be just single ideology that can do bad things. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Authoritarianism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) You lived there? How old are you? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) 50+. Do not want to give personal information on internet more than needed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) So you didn't actually experience life under the soviet gulags. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) I did not claimed I am. But Soviet ideology and fascist ideology are quite different. It is not like there must be just single ideology that can do bad things. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Authoritarianism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 child) 50+. Do not want to give personal information on internet more than needed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) So you didn't actually experience life under the soviet gulags. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) I did not claimed I am. But Soviet ideology and fascist ideology are quite different. It is not like there must be just single ideology that can do bad things. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Authoritarianism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) So you didn't actually experience life under the soviet gulags. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) I did not claimed I am. But Soviet ideology and fascist ideology are quite different. It is not like there must be just single ideology that can do bad things. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Authoritarianism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) I did not claimed I am. But Soviet ideology and fascist ideology are quite different. It is not like there must be just single ideology that can do bad things. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Authoritarianism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Authoritarianism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] MxM111@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago* Yes. There are common elements too. Yet there were quite different. There are common elements between fascism and democracy (both allow private property, for example, both have idea of state), so what? The world is not binary. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Akagigahara@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago There was the idea of bringing the revolution to others. While mostly after Stalin, the USSR heavily engaged in combat to exert its influence. The Korean and Vietnamese Civil Wars were proxy wars in which both the US and the USSR were engaged in. Then there was the soviet invasion of Afghanistan, too. Their propaganda has a lot of hints of glorifying the military, sacrifice and fanaticism. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] goat@sh.itjust.works [S] 2 points 2 years ago (2 children) Isn't doing things for the sake of the state nationalism? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago You do not do that for the sake of state. You do that for the collective. State is just bureaucratic representation of that. In fascist Germany you would do that for the Germany and German nation specifically. In USSR you do not do that for USSR or USSR nation (there was no such thing). permalink fedilink source parent [–] PugJesus@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago Generally that's regarded as civic nationalism ("People are bound together by a common government"), whereas most people think of ethnic nationalism ("People are bound together by common descent or culture") when they speak of nationalism. Though there is a strong argument to be made for the SovUnion being an extension of Russian domination over other ethnicities, just like the Russian Empire which preceded it. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] MxM111@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago You do not do that for the sake of state. You do that for the collective. State is just bureaucratic representation of that. In fascist Germany you would do that for the Germany and German nation specifically. In USSR you do not do that for USSR or USSR nation (there was no such thing). permalink fedilink source parent
[–] PugJesus@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago Generally that's regarded as civic nationalism ("People are bound together by a common government"), whereas most people think of ethnic nationalism ("People are bound together by common descent or culture") when they speak of nationalism. Though there is a strong argument to be made for the SovUnion being an extension of Russian domination over other ethnicities, just like the Russian Empire which preceded it. permalink fedilink source parent
