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[–] 126 points 2 years ago* (5 children)

On feddit.de, lemmy.world is only temporarily defederated because of CSAM until a patch is merged into Lemmy that prevents images from being downloaded to your own instance.

So I'll just be patient and wait. It's understandable the admins don't want to get problems with law enforcement.

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  • [–] 33 points 2 years ago

    Makes quite a bit of sense

    Depending on jurisdiction it can be pretty hairy if your instance downloads it

    IANAL but I'm pretty sure that in the US you have a "duty to report" and you can have legal protections if you end up getting it and then reporting it

    But IANAL so I'd recommend looking into it with an actual lawyer if you run a website that hosts content

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  • [–] 22 points 2 years ago (5 children)

    Won't that lead to some horrible hug-of-death type scenarios if a post from a small instance gets popular on a huge one?

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  • [–] 42 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Yes, but arguably it was never very scalable for federated software to store large media. It gets utterly massive quick. Third party image/video hosts that specialize in hosting those things can do a better job. And honestly, that's the kinda data that is just better suited for centralization. Many people can afford to spin up a server that mostly just stores text and deals with basic interactions. Large images or streaming video gets expensive fast, especially if the site were to ever get even remotely close to reddit levels.

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  • [–] 8 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    This is what I'm waiting for before I host my own as well. Rather not have to worry that much about constantly having to admin out CSAM.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago*

    Not to shill but I just found the other day that cloudflare has a csam scanning and reporting engine built into their proxies. In theory it gives them a window into the data stream by them decrypting and re-encrypting that could snatch a password hash, but 2FA makes that useless after a minute. Basically it scans anything that gets put in the cache and reports it, notifies you to pull it down, and automatically puts up a 451 block on the link.

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    [–] 96 points 2 years ago (14 children)

    Even on public instances, I don't understand why people think defederating hurts the fediverse. Just join a different instance, how hard can it be?

    I'm on 3 different instances right now

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  • [–] 52 points 2 years ago (9 children)

    Do we have a way to combine feeds yet? I don't know of one. So it's kinda annoying to jump from account to account to make sure your seeing everything.

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  • [–] 19 points 2 years ago (4 children)

    I'm not sure there is. Personally, I wish there were a way for an individual to block entire instances since I'm a terminally online individual with 3 accounts who sorts by all -> new for content :P

    I get what you're saying, and hopefully it's a feature that gets added. I'm sure eventually it will, or maybe someone will make an app or an add-on

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  • [–] 10 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Yes, actually! Liftoff for Lemmy is still in early development, but you can get it on iOS, Android, Windows, and Linux, and it provides precisely this feature. There are a lot of features that Liftoff is yet to incorporate, probably most notably moderator tools and support for adding Kbin accounts -- but give it a try regardless, and do what you can to contribute to its further development. Liftoff is an app with a lot of promise and a surprising amount of functionality already this early in its development.

    It's worth noting that Liftoff is a fork of the now abandoned project Lemmur, which I believe was the first Lemmy client to support combining feeds.

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  • [–] 18 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    Counterpoint: new users who don't know the ins and outs of the fediverse might join an instance at random and see significantly less content.

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  • [–] 11 points 2 years ago (5 children)

    Fair, but a lot of new users might also get discouraged if the first thing they see is content from exploding-heads or hexbear, and the instances that strive to be safe, inclusive spaces and thus do a significant amount of defederating are usually quite forthright about this when you sign up. For example, I knew just what to expect when I joined beehaw.

    The instance I'm posting from now tries to keep things inclusive more via moderation vs. defederation. There are pros and cons to each approach. I can see both perspective.

    I just don't think either approach harms the fediverse. I think that's a bit melodramatic.

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  • [–] 15 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Too many people never used forums and think every site needs to talk to every site.

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  • [–] 15 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    I don't get it either. Defederation is a tool just like banning or spam prevention. If it's unused it's pointless to have.

    But you don't ban everyone for a single offense just like to don't defederate lightly. If you do then people will move elsewhere and the problem resolves itself

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  • [–] 11 points 2 years ago

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: If instances weren't supposed to be ever defederate, then we wouldn't have the tool. In the absence of real moderation/admin tools it's going to get used more frequently. And that's the admin owner's right!

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  • [–] 10 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

    I would say that a big part of the issue is the difficulty in transferring one's account. Ignoring the fact that one simply can't transfer their posts, trying to manually copy all previously subscribed communities to a new account is a rather tedious task. I am aware that there exists scripts that can automate that process, but I don't think that it's fair to expect that the userbase should run 3rd party scripts. Until account transfer is properly implemented, defederation will continue to be a major issue.

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    [–] 67 points 2 years ago (7 children)

    It would be less of a problem if we as users on an instance could block entire instances, effectively defederating it just for our user. Then those running instances could defederate only in severe cases.

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  • [–] 22 points 2 years ago

    Blocking an instance on a user by user basis has a key drawback in the sense of those instances you block can still influence the posts and comments via up and down votes

    Defederating basically means that those instances no longer have any influence on the community you're a part of

    Basically think of it this way, say you're on a queer friendly instance that is still federated with a right wing instance. That right wing instance can manipulate the posts of the queer friendly instance by up voting queerphobic content and down voting queer positive content. And you block the instance as a user those votes still federated over so you'll see queer positive content getting down voted to oblivion.

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    [–] 53 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    "I don't like drama" is always said by people who cause drama. This drama stirring meme is 100% expected from someone who would write that title

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    [–] 49 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    The whole epidemic of defederating is mostly because of all the csam issues, no?

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  • [–] [S] 8 points 2 years ago (7 children)

    theres also some other drama with tankies and communists as far as I understand. I dont really care about political views of people

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  • [–] 6 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    tbh i have noticed them a lot less in the last couple weeks. maybe they're giving up

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  • [–] 22 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    I'm out of the loop, who's defedding fro what now?

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  • [–] 13 points 2 years ago

    Drama? In the fediverse? It's more likely than you think!

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  • [–] 9 points 2 years ago
    [–] 7 points 2 years ago

    That white shoe between his feet confused the hell out of me for a second there...

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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago

    This is hearsay, but you might want to be careful of csam material potentially being federated if you self host your instance.

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