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[–] 21 points 3 days ago

Most of the MKUltra documents were destroyed, we only have what we have because some were stored at a different location unbeknownst to those ordered to destroy them. We only know a small part of what they did.

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  • [–] 13 points 3 days ago (1 child)

    A family friend that my mom grew up with was considered crazy for a number of years until the MKUltra documents came out. He was a repeat subject they gang stalked and kidnapped multiple times when they would go out to the bars and dosed the fuck out of him and did weird Clockwork Orange shit. He got much better afterwords just by knowing what he went through was real and having other people finally believe him. I can’t imagine the psychological torture of actually having that level of shit happen to you and nobody believing you, because it actually does just objectively sounds fucking ridiculous, had those documents never came out he is 100% sure he would have ended up killing himself.

    This was just one of the many things they have done and are actively doing that they fully planned to hide away forever.

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  • [–] 6 points 2 days ago (1 child)
  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

    That’s not even “not that far off,” that’s literally the kind of shit they do.

    From what he’s told me, they would dress as clowns, aliens, cowboys, all sorts of shit, in locations made to look like space ships or circus tents, they’d have him eat pancakes and watch Loonie Tunes in the middle of things, or a big tittied lady would hold him and talk to him like a baby. They knew what they were doing, there are without doubt people who have been driven to insanity because even they couldn’t believe that shit happened to them.

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  • [–] 81 points 4 days ago (9 children)

    It's incredible how many things have gone from "insane conspiracy theory" to "yes, declassified documents prove that the CIA actually did this".

    Makes me wonder what things they're doing right now that might be declassified in a few decades... Makes me wonder what things they've done that were so fucked up that they still haven't declassified them.

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  • [–] 29 points 3 days ago* (2 children)

    I regularly wonder how much of the dark sci-fi we’ve been cooking up over the years is just unaware documentary.

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  • [–] 24 points 3 days ago (5 children)

    There's this reporter, Ross Coulthart, started going off about aliens and UFOs and telepathy and weird shit recently. He is an award winning investigative reporter who got turned into an alien reporter.

    Well I noticed one day he starts talking about the GATE program (gifted and talented education) and testing children for psionic ability... Then i remember my parents trying to get me to try out for GATE and taking me to some weird building where they gave me weird psychic tests...

    I failed them, but it proved to me that life is way stranger than we give it credit for. Yes, there are secret government programs looking for telepathic children. I've seen proof. That's probably just the tip of iceberg if so.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    Yeah, people are like "But MKUltra was shut down and declassified!"

    Rrrriiiiigghhhttttt...

    "But what about second MKUltra?"

    "I don't think he knows about second MKUltra..."

    But mention that and they'll be like "EvIdEnCe?!?!?!"

    As if the CIA would be open and forthcoming with documentation proving that MKUltra has a successor program...

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  • [–] 3 points 2 days ago (2 children)

    Yeah, people are like “But MKUltra was shut down and declassified!”

    And not voluntarily, either. It's not like the CIA willingly gave up on it -- they only did that after it was discovered and there was widespread public outcry over it. Also, the CIA didn't declassify it -- the CIA destroyed most of the documents related to it, and Congress declassified (most of) what was left.

    Given that the CIA was very much against shutting it down and declassifying it, I think it's very likely that they replaced it with a similar new program that's still running and still secret.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago

    Yeah, I would be downright surprised if I somehow learned that they didn't simply start a new program to take it's place. Not that something like that could ever be proved. But I find it absurd that people pretend that's some crackpot conspiracy theory.

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  • [–] 13 points 3 days ago (1 child)

    Most of it is probably about mass surveillance and their propaganda machine.

    I wonder if they have an evolved version of mkultra, maybe testing it right now on Maduro.

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  • [–] 6 points 3 days ago*

    I doubt mkultra was ever about individuals rather than mass mind control.

    Also, why be afraid of an evolved version of mkultra when social media is brainwashing people into believing literally anything? Well, anything as long as it conforms to your personal biases. Social media companies have achieved what the CIA could never do.

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  • [–] 4 points 3 days ago (2 children)

    It's a funky cognitive dissonance in my head. On one hand, conspiracy theories are deliberately engineered for propaganda and distractions. On the other hand, everything surrounding Epstein makes Pizzagate look like a mundane theory in comparison, both oddly involving the Clinton's.

    It feels like damned if you do damned if you don't. In a lot of cases Occam's Razor is the only thing that makes a conspiracy obviously wrong, but reality is so strange that the simplest answer doesn't cut it anymore.

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  • [–] 4 points 3 days ago (1 child)

    So this is a bit not picky, but Occam's razor isn't just about the simplest. It is if two hypotheses both equally explain a phenomenon you should choose the simplest. It also could be explained as choosing the explanation the requires the fewest assumptions. So it still allows for complexity in the hypotheses, but aims to reduce complexity when a simpler answer will suffice.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago

    My theory is that Epstein & Associates started QAnon and Pizzagate et al in order to make conspiracy theorists look crazy and desensitize people to allegations of high-ranking government officials and other influential or wealthy individuals doing shady and evil stuff.

    Also, Occam's Razors is a literal fallacy. Always has been. In formal logic they call it jumping to conclusions.

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    [–] 34 points 3 days ago (1 child)

    It is openly terrifying how The stance of the American government is basically yeah we did that what are you going to do about it?

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  • [–] 3 points 2 days ago

    Also frustrating that it isn't even the same people because the ones that did that shit already retired and/or died before it was declassified. There isn't really much to do about it, even if the government is willing. Any apology isn't from those who actually did it. Any reparations are paid for with taxes. Any promise to do better could be a lie and probably won't be known for sure until the ones making it are dead and their documents are declassified.

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  • [–] 23 points 3 days ago

    i remember one time at work we were talking about this stuff, and one of our bosses straight up said the cia has never done anything like that. i really mean it when i say every working class employee busted out laughing.

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  • [–] 35 points 3 days ago* (3 children)

    The MK Ultra program being real is fucking insane.

    The fact they still employ "far seers" is also insane, and I don't know if it's insane because they use absolute bogus things seriously, or if that shit is actually real somehow. Like there has to be reason they have 'em still, you know?

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  • [–] 13 points 3 days ago (1 child)

    Didnt they try to summon dieties and demons from several large religions just in case they were real? The cia was fucking insane(still is prolly, we just have to wait 30 years for them to reveal what they were doing)

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    [–] 9 points 3 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

    MLK Jr, Black Panthers, Malcolm X

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  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago

    A lot of it is incompetence and wasted resources. It's not that crazy.

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  • [–] 18 points 3 days ago

    Recommend the book Safe for Democracy by John Prados. It's a damn doorstop and gets pretty dry at parts (think a full outline of the obtuse bureaucratic names various covert working groups gave themselves), but it's an exhaustive record of the CIA from their founding up to their adventures in Afghanistan.

    It mostly focuses on armed conflict rather than the cloak and dagger spy games, but still shows the lengths the agency has gone to just because a world leader leaned a little too far left for their liking.

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  • [–] 12 points 3 days ago (6 children)

    Can't believe none asked yet: what's your favorite four? I in the comments I see Pokemon Go, MK Ultra, Project Stargate. Not even four!

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  • [–] 13 points 3 days ago (3 children)

    MK Ultra on its own could count for several.

    Was the experiment where they released some "harmless pathogen" (assuming your immune system is all good!) in major cities to see how they spread, resulting in some deaths/complications part of MK Ultra? Can't remember if it was under that project or part of a different one leading up to it.

    The Iran/contras were CIA.

    Oh also the Iranian revolution, or at least the instability that led to it.

    Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden both started as CIA assets that got tired of being used.

    A lot of attempts on Fidel Castro's life.

    That's off the top of my head. There's also a bunch of fuckery in central and south America, though if I had to guess, I would guess that there has been fuckery in every single country on this planet, including countries some would have called allies. Iirc they targeted some Canadian cities for that "release the pathogen" experiment, too.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    On the subject of MK Ultra we shouldn't forget Canada also has some culpability there.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago

    Yeah, the CIA weren't openly involved (Cameron, the one who did the experiments claimed to be unaware of CIA involvement but who knows), McGill claimed to be unaware but they went on for 9 years, so even if that's true, it could be considered negligence. And the Canadian government funded it.

    And when it came out, there was an investigation that concluded they didn't act irresponsibly.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago

    The family jewels documents are nice. After the cia had former employees "slightly" involved in Watergate, the CIA sent out a memo asking everyone for their records on things that happened that probably would be illegal.

    It's like a short story collection of weird criminal shit. "We kidnapped this Russian for three years. Why? Well, he said he wanted to leave the Soviet Union after spying for us for a while and we thought that was suspicious, so we locked him in a room for a few years.". "We gave a bunch of poison to the Mafia and had them wander around Havana" "we weren't technically allowed to do that with the telephone"

    Pre-cia there was the radioactive foxes.

    Finally is the weirdly open CIA investment company inqtel.

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    "Airplane crashing" democratic leaders who wouldn't allow parasitic American corporations to rape their country's resources.

    Also, smuggling a shit ton of coke into the US.

    Nope. It's the gubment so they obviously have authority iand are good nstead of being an entitled bunch of psychopaths.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago

    Remember Operation Condor?

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  • [–] 19 points 4 days ago

    Heh heh, good times

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  • [–] 9 points 3 days ago

    And only crickets went to jail for all of that

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  • [–] 8 points 3 days ago

    Pokemon Go.

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