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Leading US imams and scholars urge Muslim voters to snub Kamala Harris over Gaza (www.middleeasteye.net)
submitted 2 years ago by to c/worldnews@lemmy.ml
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/20911849

By Umar A Farooq in Washington
Published date: 30 September 2024 11:01 BST

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[–] 17 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Just bewilderment. Because snubbing Harris will get you Trump. Who's a great friend to Gaza /s. So cui bono?

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  • [–] 17 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Both are genocidal, letting the DNC get away with genocide solidifies their position. That's the logic, that the DNC can get away with literal genocide as long as they aren't the GOP, and in the eyes of Liberals, that's correct.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    You seem to think that letting the more genocidal republicans win would encourage the democrats to be less genocidal, which is bizarre.

    They move right when they lose to compete with the republicans because the republicans win with a right wing strategy.

    If the democrats won all the time, the republicans would have to move left just to regain power, and the Overton window would move left.

    Not voting for the democrats in order to move them left is insanity. They will respond by copying the more successful electoral strategy.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    You seem to think that letting the more genocidal republicans win would encourage the democrats to be less genocidal, which is bizarre.

    They are the same. They both support Israel undyingly, Biden is even sending in the troops.

    They move right when they lose to compete with the republicans because the republicans win with a right wing strategy.

    They move right because that's what their donors want.

    If the democrats won all the time, the republicans would have to move left just to regain power, and the Overton window would move left.

    No, they wouldn't. Fascism is Capitalism in decay, both parties are always moving rightward.

    Not voting for the democrats in order to move them left is insanity. They will respond by copying the more successful electoral strategy.

    If the Democrats don't want to regain left votes then they are too far gone and we need a revolution.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    You've tied yourself into all kinds of intricate knots. It's simple. If you convince all the people who care about Gaza not to vote, things get worse for Gaza.

    If only right wing people vote, only right wing policies will win.

    If only right wing policies win, only right wing policies will be offered.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    You've tied yourself into all kinds of intricate knots. It's simple. If you convince all the people who care about Gaza not to vote, things get worse for Gaza.

    I have not. Things will not get worse for Gaza under Trump or Harris, they are fully aligned. Pretending it's good for Palestinians to be murdered because the bombs are sent by a Dem is monstrous.

    Plus, I advocate voting, just for PSL or the Greens, anti-genocide parties.

    If only right wing people vote, only right wing policies will win.

    Dems are far-right as well, lmao. If you want left views represented, vote for left parties.

    If only right wing policies win, only right wing policies will be offered.

    Parties pick policies based on donors, not on the public's opinion.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    Well, you go ahead and continue to push the democrats right then. I can't convince you. The outcome of the election will definitely convince the democrats. And I can tell you they will listen to the republican voters before they log on to lemmy.ml because there's so many more of them and they actually vote in a way that affects the outcome.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    And I can tell you you will continue to support the increasingly right wing Democrats, and in 20 years, if Leftists save the world, you'll look back on your right-wing support with disgust.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    They move right when they lose. So that they can win again.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    If they move right, you'll still support that until the end of the world. You would vote for Hitler if Hitler+ was the opponent, instead of lifting a finger against the system.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    Well, unlike you, I can tell the difference between Hitler and the democratic party. You're so full of false equivalence.

    If they move left, you'll still not vote for them because you're too pure to compromise and you will forever throw your supposedly leftist ideals on the dustbin of throwing what tiny tiny tiny power you have away and convincing anyone that shares your views to do the same.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Well, unlike you, I can tell the difference between Hitler and the democratic party. You're so full of false equivalence.

    Where is the red line for you to stop supporting the increasingly right-wing Democrats? It certainly isn't genocide, you're voting for that this time around, so is there a meaningful point of no return? If not, you would vote for Hitler.

    If they move left, you'll still not vote for them because you're too pure to compromise and you will forever throw your supposedly leftist ideals on the dustbin of throwing what tiny tiny tiny power you have away and convincing anyone that shares your views to do the same.

    I have been advocating for revolution this entire thread. I am advocating for people to stop supporting the genocidal US Empire and do something other than legitimizing the US Terrorist State.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Like I said, you're an accelerationist who wants it to get as bad as possible as far as possible because you think revolution will come sooner that way, and you don't care how bad the world gets in the meanwhile.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    I haven't said anything of the sort, you just make up whatever strawman stances you want to attack because it's more convenient for you than confronting the fact that you support genocide.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    I agree that you didn't admit it.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    You didn't admit to being a genocide enthusiast either, but more than anything your "lesser evil" rhetoric shows that you'd goosestep with the Democrats right into Hell.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

    Your greater evil rhetoric puts the actual fascists in charge of America. Did you read project 2025 yet? Or even a summary?

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  • [–] 2 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Of course I have, I go for the "no evil" option and implore you to do so as well.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    The fascists winning doesn't trouble you at all, though, which is weird for a leftist, no? I smell republicans in disguise.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    Of course the dems or reps winning is troubling for me, the fact that you want the dems to win is troubling. We have established that you're far-right though, which is par for the course I suppose.

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  • [+] -12 points 2 years ago* (3 children)

    You're currently a Trump supporter. If you don't want to be one, you can stop.

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  • [–] 14 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

    Nah, fuck Trump. The only way I could be seen as a Trump supporter is if you think voting for genocide should be the default.

    You're currently batting for genocide, imperialism, climate collapse, and World War 3, but you can stop.

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  • [–] -2 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    The first-past-the-post voting system sucks; the resulting two-party system sucks; but right now we have to operate within it. The mathematics of that system entail the simple fact that if you discourage people from keeping Trump out, you are helping get Trump in. That makes you a Trump supporter.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    The first-past-the-post voting system sucks; the resulting two-party system sucks; but right now we have to operate within it

    Only if you think voting is the extent of political action.

    The mathematics of that system entail the simple fact that if you discourage people from keeping Trump out, you are helping get Trump in

    And if you encourage getting Harris in, you are helping Harris get in, who has promised imperalism, genocide, World War 3, and failed Climate action.

    That makes you a Trump supporter.

    In 20 years you'll look back at yourself, if leftists have managed to prevent the end of the world, as someone who supported a fascist regime and refused to lift a finger against it. I hope you'll come to your senses much sooner than that.

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  • [+] -3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (4 children)
    [removed by mod]
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  • [–] 9 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    “Both sides are just as bad!” is the bullshit that got us the George W. Bush administration and the Iraq War.

    Yet Obama did nothing to hold Bush Jr and his administration accountable for their crimes

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  • [–] 4 points 2 years ago

    “Both sides are just as bad!” is the bullshit

    It's not that they are identical, it's that delineating between the Hitlerites and the Strasserites just isn't very meaningful compared to the understanding that they are wings of the same monstrous entity that needs to be destroyed. You don't even need to Obamas embracing Bush and saying "same values" to see that, but seeing that makes denial inexcusable.

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  • [–] 6 points 2 years ago

    The first-past-the-post voting system sucks; the resulting two-party system sucks; but

    The hand-wringing isn't the worst part, but it's definitely the most annoying. "Don't worry, I'm disavowing Harris while I vote for her in my non-swing-state, so it doesn't count even as she uses those votes to claim legitimacy just like Biden did".

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  • [–] 9 points 2 years ago

    Both hate Arabs and Muslims, Trump is just honest about it. Both support Israel unconditionally, the reality on the ground will be exactly the same, only the rhetoric will change.

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