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Opinion: Distributions that only change non-system pre-installed software or desktop environment should instead be packages or scripts (lemmy.ml)
submitted 3 years ago* by [M] to c/linux@lemmy.ml
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The majority of Linux distributions out there seem to be over-engineering their method of distribution. They are not giving us a new distribution of Linux. They are giving us an existing distribution of Linux, but with a different distribution of non-system software (like a different desktop environment or configuration of it)

In many cases, turning an installation of the base distribution used to the one they're shipping is a matter of installing certain packages and setting some configurations. Why should the user be required to reinstall their whole OS for this?

It would be way more practical if those distributions are available as packages, preferably managed by the package manager itself. This is much easier for both the user and the developer.

Some developers may find it less satisfying to do this, and I don't mean to force my opinion on anyone, but only suggesting that there's an easier way to do this. Distributions should be changing things that aren't easily doable without a system reinstall.

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[–] 6 points 3 years ago* (4 children)

Debian would not create and maintain a "core debian" variant just to be installed then receive the extra packages

Debian server minimal, is kind of a "core Debian". There are netinst versions that can be even smaller. The Debian base image for Docker is even smaller than all that.

There is also an Ubuntu minimal install that you could call "core Ubuntu".

But more importantly, and I can't stress this enough: YOU CAN SWITCH DISTROS WITHOUT REINSTALLING. Might need to do some cleanup afterwards, but it's perfectly doable, more so between Debian based ones.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    Uninstalling the entire kubuntu package, while reverting to “core Debian” and then installing the Ubuntu package would be more complicated and time-consuming than installing a new OS.

    Just partition off your /home and a reinstall won’t be that big a deal.

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  • [–] [S] 1 point 3 years ago

    I want kubuntu?

    Step 1: install Ubuntu (the farthest ancestor of kubuntu that does more than change non system packages) Step 2: install kubuntu package: sudo apt install kubuntu

    Oh well, I decided I want lubuntu instead

    Step 1: uninstall kubuntu: sudo apt remove kubuntu Step 2: install lububtu: sudo apt install lubuntu

    That is my proposal. It is WAY simpler than reinstalling.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 years ago* (2 children)

    YOU CAN SWITCH DISTROS WITHOUT REINSTALLING. Might need to do some cleanup afterwards, but it’s perfectly doable, more so between Debian based ones.

    How do you do that? First time hearing this

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  • [–] 4 points 3 years ago

    Replace Debian apt sources with Ubuntu ones, do system upgrade and install the Ubuntu-Desktop package, now you have Ubuntu.

    It's been a while since I have done this, but it's totally possible.

    We did this transition from Ubuntu to Debian at Work with thousands of workstations.

    It requires a bit of time and testing but it's possible.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago

    What @exi@feddit.de said. Switching .deb based distros is little more than changing sources, maybe some pinning, doing an upgrade, and optionally a cleanup pass to remove any stranglers.

    My main Linux box is a Debian-Ubuntu-Debian upgrade, that hasn't seen a proper reinstall for like 15 years (switched all the hardware several times, still no clean reinstall).

    Switching between non-deb distros is also possible, with a chroot. Like, Gentoo to Fedora. As long as the kernel is compatible with the glibc, it's basically like running containers, just on slightly hard mode.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago (1 child)

    A minimal install like debian base already has a things that may differ from distro to distro. Or are you equating "distro" with window manager and GUI customizations? Even the kernel binaries may differ from distro to distro.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago

    I know what I said. Linux upholds the "don't break userspace" contract pretty well: most kernels, particularly those from generalistic distros built with modules, are compatible with whatever userspace binaries you throw at them. Major version changes in glibc (or equivalent) is where incompatibilities start, but those happen quite rarely, and you can often still force multiple glibc versions to run side by side.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago (1 child)

    YOU CAN SWITCH DISTROS WITHOUT REINSTALLING

    this will blow your mind

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  • [–] 2 points 3 years ago

    Not really, I'm not new to containers.

    This might blow yours though: I once booted up from a Tomsrtbt disk, installed Debian, added some RedHat packages, and topped it up with some pinned downgrades from Ubuntu.

    On bare metal, no containers, no rebooting.

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