598
crowdStrikeIsAVerbNow (lemmy.world)
submitted 2 years ago by to c/programmerhumor@lemmy.ml
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[+] -23 points 2 years ago (5 children)

So why is this considered a crowdstrike issue and not a Microsoft fuckup?

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  • [–] 64 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    Windows: exists

    Crowdstrike: stabs

    You: why would Microsoft stab themselves?

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  • [–] 23 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    To be fair, kernel level access by third party software is kind of frowned upon in the Linux world. Ask any desktop Linux user how they feel about NVIDIA (the only third party kernel code an average Linux user will install) and their drivers randomly causing strange issues on their systems up to and including kernel panics compared to the experience on AMD where the driver is open and built into the kernel itself. For security software that needs low level visibility, there is eBPF, direct kernel level access isn't needed (though I believe CrowdStrike uses it, and thay actually did CrowdStrike Debian and Rocky Linux systems some time back).

    MacOS blocked the majority of kernel extensions a few years ago as well.

    Windows is the only OS where it has been designed in a way where kernel level access is the rule rather than the exception. So design flaws are at least partially at fault here.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 years ago

    The opinion of Linux desktop users (or any users really) do not count in the enterprise world. Somehow, if management bought in on the Crowdstrike rootkit bandwagon, you'll see it on corporate hardware. It doesn't matter if it's a bad plan; it doesn't matter if it gives an American company a backdoor to all you infrastructure; if the CISO decides everyone gets it, everyone get it.

    The only thing you can really do as a lowly employee is keep any such device away from any personal info or network as if it's infected by malware (which I would argue is exactly what it is).

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  • [–] 19 points 2 years ago

    Windows: exists

    Crowdstrike: exists

    Windows: open belly, right here!

    Crowdstrike: stabs

    Crowdstrike released bad code into prod without giving it some hours of testing in local machines or whatever. Incredible fuckup, inimaginable. But, let's not take blame out of Microsoft, if a driver is faulty the system should be resilient enough no to crap the bed on login. At least enough for IT to be able to remotely access the system and fix it. The manual work the IT world has had to do because it's lost remote access to workstations is insane.

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  • [+] 24 points 2 years ago (1 child)
    [deleted]
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  • [–] -2 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    OTOH, if you build a playlist manager for playlists everyone can add to, you make sure nothing anyone adds will break it…

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  • [–] 6 points 2 years ago

    Except that the playlists are super complex and there is no way to make sure. Like building an engine and having to make sure that no 3rd party accessory will break it. Like the parented "sand injector".

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  • [+] 5 points 2 years ago (1 child)
    [deleted]
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  • [–] 3 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    What do you think WHQL is?

    The problem with CrowdStrike's solution is that they got csagent.sys driver signed by WHQL, and the driver will download p-code from the internet and execute it. This allows them to push out changes without waiting for Microsoft approval.

    The biggest problem occurs when you don't sanitize your inputs and someone accidentally uploads a blank file padded with zeroes. The driver dereferences a null value, and crashes your system. Hard.

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  • [–] 19 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Can you explain why you think this is a Microsoft issue?

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  • [–] 0 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Doesn’t Microsoft allow crowdstrike to make updates? Being such a critical part of the OS it’s up to Microsoft to ensure their procedures are robust and being followed.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago* (1 child)

    How do you implement that? How is it feasible that Microsoft tests all the third party drivers?

    Don't get me wrong I believe Microsoft is partly to blame for this problem as well but for making it so hard for system admins to go around the system and solve things (as compared to Linux where you can do anything). I think sys admins would have solved this much faster if they were using Linux systems

    I was just probing your argument because I guessed it was the typical nonsense of Microsoft bad, Linux good, without a good explanation

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago* (1 child)

    I think if it’s going on every windows computer windows should have a process in place to prevent what happened from happening. Windows are for profit, they have the money to do it right but they got greedy. A staggered rollout would have prevented most of it and is a very simple thing to require. Also if it’s going on every windows computer or most I wouldn’t consider that a third party anymore even if that’s how they keep liabilities at arms length

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  • [–] 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 child)

    I think if it’s going on every windows computer

    It's not, its just popular. Its not windows job to police what software you choose to run on it.

    However Windows does actually have an optional certification program called WHQL for kernal level drivers. Getting this certification lets updates get posted via windows' internal updater. It checks the driver calls apis correctly and doesn't misbehave with interrupt handling among other tests. Crowdstrike driver did pass this, and in fact there was no bug with the driver, the bug was with the configuration file. The configuration file updates about once an hour (and it really needs to do that), and does so outside the windows update process, making windows powerless to control its rollout. whql certification takes a few days to run and configuration files aren't really in scope.

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  • [–] 10 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    Same thing would happen on Linux if someone wrote a bad kernel module and integrated it into the OS. In fact, Crowdstrike did have a similar problem a few months ago on Linux.

    I'm no fan of Microsoft, but this isn't their fault.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 years ago (1 child)

    An OS should not have to require a 3rd party driver for security.

    Microsoft should be writing that driver as an OS component. Drivers should be restricted for taking to hardware.

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