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We can win if we kill everybody. (lemmygrad.ml)
submitted 3 years ago by to c/genzedong@lemmygrad.ml
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[–] 0 points 3 years ago (2 children)

There's a risk [...] that Zelenskiy will be forced into negotiations

Oh well, quite mask off

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    That line pissed me off bc Xi Jinping and a few other non-aligned states have tried to get them to the diplomatic table and end this, but obv Zelenskyy was too self-centered and war-hungry to see reason.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    I heard about Xi Jingping doing this but never heard what resulted of that. Does anyone have good documentation of the conversation?

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    Zelensky told Xi he want Crimea back

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (2 children)

    Please correct me if I’m wrong, but didn’t Crimea (or was it a different region) want to be annexed by Russia and that’s what made NATO step in?

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    Crimea was handed to Ukraine by Krushchev in the time of the USSR, it was Russian before that for I don't know how long, but as others said pretty much everyone living in Crimea is Russian to this day.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    the people there wanted to join the Russian Federation for a long time, and it finally happened after the fascist coup

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    Okay so it was Crimea that wanted to leave Ukraine. I see so many regional names thrown around I get confused so thank you.

    Anyway, at this point if they wanted to leave to damn bad why is Zelensky being so stubborn? The people there don’t even want to be a part of Ukraine anymore, why would he want to keep it?

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (1 child)

    It's not really about Zelensky, he's basically a figurehead, like most leaders in capitalist countries. The capitalists (Ukrainian and foreign, mainly Amerikan) and the military are more or less in control of Ukraine at this point (Zelensky himself was heavily funded by one of Ukraine's largest capitalists). As for why they care about retaining Crimea, I'm sure there are economic reasons for the Ukrainian capitalists, Amerika is likely just using it to ensure that there won't be a peace deal, and there are certainly reasons for the Nazis who control the military; if you look at what they've done to people they viewed as Russian collaborators throughout the conflict and what they've been doing to the people in the Donbas, you can imagine what they'd do if they got a hold of Crimea

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  • [–] 2 points 3 years ago*

    Crimea is actually super strategic point, if you look at history of Russia. Whomever controls it, control several trade routes including the main Russian river trade route, and also have good chance to control Black Sea. You can see a lot of countries vying for power there - from Byzantium through Crimean Tatars, Turkey to Russia. And for Russia it is the most significant trade route even today - if you ever wondered why Russian Empire wanted Constantinople and USSR pressed Turkey for neutrality it was precisely to secure this route.

    So when USSR was destroyed and Crimea ended up in Ukraine, Russia found itself potentially cut off from Black Sea militarily, thus without option to actually secure its own main trade route. That's why they secured the lease of the port of Sevastopol, but it was half measure, as became evident in 2014, one of the main reasons of USA supporting that coup was to annul that lease and kick off Russian Navy from Black Sea which would allow easy grabbing Russia by the balls economically. Russia obviously was prepared for that and they immediately pushed for the annexation.

    So, @SpaceDogs@lemmygrad.ml Zelensky probably don't give a shit, but his CIA handlers do.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    don't you get it? how can we establish democratic peace if we don't bomb those russians and take over their land? You can't be kind and talk it out, especially against these russians. Now I understand civilians are involved. But then, why did they vote for Putsin? They aren't so different from the government, and if they hate it so much, just get out of there. not that difficult. why are people talking about international peace relations as if it can be achieved? Violence is inherent in us. It is a human trait. Didn't international peace cause Stalin and Nazi Germany to kill 10 trillion people? People should take this more seriously and keep emotions off politics. For fucks sake.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (1 child)

    how can we establish democratic peace if we don't bomb those russians and take over their land?

    Barely anybody says that besides some uninteresting figures mentioning a ridiculous idea of balkanizing Russia... (Balkanize my balls).

    But then, why did they vote for Putsin?

    Putin isn't a legitimate leader who got honest public's vote. In reality most of Russians who are dependent to governmental institutions are forced to participate in the electoral apparatus for statistics' sake only. People just have to show up. There's various cases of fully discovered falsifications, independent spectatorship isn't allowed. The whole process is just shady, especially after "online vote" has been established, which has pretty non-trasperent protocol.

    They aren't so different from the government, and if they hate it so much, just get out of there. not that difficult.

    Unironically this, since the summer of 2021 Zelensky has been pushing for proper face-to-face negotiations with Vladimir Putin personally and was... Geopolitically ghosted. Zelensky was ready to make Pashinyan at the start of the war and basically... Give up Crimean region. Seeing all of the tactical and local failures of Russian military made it obvious that they weren't planning for long-term, full-scale attrition war that required full involvement and genuine contributions from society.

    Why are people talking about international peace relations as if it can be achieved?

    Modern humanity established certain systems throughout these two centuries, despite all of the internal contradictions of modern governments' development and longing for full-scale mobilized and militarized societies, we created mostly consistent precedents of geopolitical relations... Yes, they're hypocritical, yes, they're not fair and they left an irrational policeman with a huge propane baton in charge of our globalized economy, but at least they prevent consistent genocides, long-term attrition wars amongst European nations.

    Didn't international peace cause Stalin and Nazi Germany to kill 10 trillion people?

    Entirely backwards, Stalin and Nazi Germany killing 10 trillion people caused international peace.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (1 child)

    So...how did a shitlib get their account approved? xD

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    Putin isn't a left-wing leader to call me a shitlib for criticizing him.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    You aren't criticizing, you're regurgitating shitlib propaganda.

    And thanks for proving your brain works on markers for the people in the back.

    P.S. Сёмин и Рудой из запоя уже вышли?)

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (1 child)

    Ah, so you're a zhozhik... Honestly, I'd pick Syomin over Rudoy any day. But arguing with a zhozhik is just a pity method of attracting trivial self-insults.

    And thanks for proving your brain works on markers for the people in the back.

    Honestly don't know what you meant by that...

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) (1 child)

    Works like a charm...

    Also, you missed.

    For local comrades: "Zhocheki" is a group of ML content creators from post-Soviet countries that didn't jump on Syomin's 180 wagon when he started retranslating western bullshit all of a sudden come SMO and have been working closely with humanitarian aid organizations in Donbass since.

    You know, real traitors of Marxism. /s

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (2 children)

    Honestly... I'd like to tinker anybody's emotional triggers a bit, but that's not going to be a discussion, I already did with this unnecessary inclusion of Zhozhik buzzword, which was just falling into your trap as it is totally unrelated to the points discussed. You still haven't explained what you meant by "markers", is that a Lemmy thing?

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) (1 child)

    Comrades, please be nice to each other, and argue in good faith. Also please do not randomly downvote.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (1 child)

    I'm not down voting, but jerboa is kinda buggy for me, that's why I have to check votes by upvoting users and sometimes I can't edit or delete my messages, or they get deleted out of nowhere (I'm sure it's a client side issue, they aren't getting sent at all).

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    Would you please tell me how to Report a user here.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    If you're on the web UI, click the elipses, then the flag icon.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) (1 child)

    "falling into my trap" doesn't absolve you of anything. You did it, because you're what I thought you are.

    You still haven’t explained what you meant by “markers”, is that a Lemmy thing?

    No, markers are your brain thing and you want to have it sorted out. Putin is ok to criticize say anything and everything about, because he isn't a leftist leader, any Russian lefty who doesn't like trots like Syomin and Rudoy is a zhozhek...- them's the markers. And you think in those.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (1 child)

    Wait, isn't that funny how I allowed the discussion to flow by your standards, which was basically what I meant by "falling into your trap" - basically, assigning buzzwords and reacting to such buzzwords like "shitlib", "liberal propaganda", "zhozhik". propaganda". If you expected anything else, then I'm sorry for treating you seriously and expecting something above pointing markers... You could entertain the discussion whenever you wanted, I wasn't holding you back from doing that instead of pointing markers and tinkering ones emotional triggers like some trivial Russian left YouTubers...

    Yes, exactly, if something isn't left-wing it deserves to be criticized, is it not, just like Ukraine, modern national relation, but as long as we live in the real world, we still have to understand internal contradictions of said systems and reasons why they exist, their benefits, and what preceded them in order to move forward and build a fair society, supporting a shady autocrat doesn't do that.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago (1 child)

    ...if something isn’t left-wing it deserves to be criticized...

    Just because cucktin deserves to be criticized doesn't mean your criticism isn't shit.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago* (1 child)

    Keep being angry /shrug I'm always here for a good criticism of Putin and clarification where I overstepped myself.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago)

    For starters, saying "Zelensky is a legitimate representative of nation, autonomy and sovereignty" is patently absurd. I could see a westerner buying into this shit because Zelensky love is astroturfed to all hell here and the average person in my part of the world benefits from the defeat of ruzzia, but I would expect ruzzianz like you to at least be aware of the euromaidan coup and shelling of the Donbass.

    Second, even if we were to assume that ruzzia is the aggressor, not budging to requests to negotiations unless ruzzia returns Crimea is pursuing a goal that is not only incredibly unlikely to achieve, but one that will be paid for with more blood than Ukraine has left to bleed.

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