▲ 782 ▼ Girl, 13, gives birth after she was raped and denied abortion in Mississippi (www.theguardian.com) submitted 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) by MicroWave@lemmy.world to c/news@lemmy.world 126 comments fedilink hide all child comments The nearest abortion clinic – in Chicago – was too far away and too expensive for her mother to provide her with the procedure
[–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 124 points 3 years ago (4 children) This is what Republicans want for all of us. If Republicans win the next election, they will institute a national abortion ban without exceptions for rape or incest. If you want to stop this, the only way to do so is to vote for Biden. I really hope people understand this. permalink fedilink source hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 53 points 3 years ago What it's going to take is to vote in Biden, then whoever the Democrats run in 2028, 2032, 2036. Until enough of the Republican justices die in office that actual jurists can replace them. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Sightline@lemmy.ml 6 points 3 years ago (2 children) That's not the only way of stopping them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Sir_Kevin@discuss.online -1 points 3 years ago This is the way. permalink fedilink source parent [+] DessertStorms@kbin.social -7 points 3 years ago (1 child) It's not even a way to stop them. Biden has literally been president during this whole Roe v Wade overturning. It's so exhausting to see libs walk this line so close to being actual progressives, but not, all for their precious capitalism. You're never going to beat the system by playing within the rules it's set you, the house always wins. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 20 points 3 years ago (1 child) Okay. Outline a reasonable action Biden could have taken to prevent the ruling. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] McNasty@sh.itjust.works 4 points 3 years ago (2 children) He could have pushed to have it codified. He could have also pushed student loan forgiveness for all borrowers instead of the bullshit means testing that got it shut down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 22 points 3 years ago (1 child) Without 60 votes in the Senate, shit, without 50, it codification of abortion rights wasn't happening. And he did push loan forgiveness, the Supreme Court shut that down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] McNasty@sh.itjust.works -14 points 3 years ago (1 child) It got shut down because of the means testing he included. If he hadn't excluded some borrowers it would have gone through. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 18 points 3 years ago Nope, it got shut down because the court ruled that it amounted to the executive appropriating money. Means testing is constitutional. permalink fedilink source parent [–] prole@sh.itjust.works 14 points 3 years ago It wasn't the means testing that shut it down, if anything it wouldn't have made it as far as it did without the means testing. As it is, people were already complaining that it was a giveaway to wealthy folks who don't need it. Take away the income limit and it would have less than zero chance of succeeding. The president has very little power over legislative decisions. Yes, he could have used the bully pulpit to advocate for abortion legislation, but it would have accomplished nothing. permalink fedilink source parent [–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml 2 points 3 years ago (2 children) Why can't Biden do something to safeguard abortion in his current term? If he can't do something on his current term, why will he be able to do something on his next one? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 30 points 3 years ago (1 child) Biden doesn't have the authority to safeguard abortion. He had the authority to veto Congress. Biden would veto a nationwide abortion ban. Trump or any other Republican would not. Additionally, presidents appoint supreme Court justices in the event of a vacancy, or if Congress ever gets on board for expanding the court.. do we'd need a Democrat in office if we're ever going to reverse Dobbs. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -3 points 3 years ago (1 child) Can't he do it temporarily via executive order? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 16 points 3 years ago No. It isn't in the scope of executive powers. If there was a national law protecting the right to abortion, he could use executive orders to enforce that. But that isn't the world we live in anymore. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RecursiveParadox@lemmy.world 25 points 3 years ago (1 child) It would take an act of congress, and the D's don't have the votes. Shitty but true. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Don't bother, he's from Lemmygrad and just wants to blame the Democrats for everything permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml 0 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, I'm not even from the US. My question is, in my opinion, an obvious one, at least to an outsider to the US political system. Why do you have to vote him again, when he's in power now? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 15 points 3 years ago* His presidential subscription needs to be re-upped every Summer Olympics permalink fedilink source parent [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 14 points 3 years ago (1 child) Because presidents serve for a limited number of years. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Of which he had 4 in total to do something about abortions, so I fail to see how that's an adequate answer permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 13 points 3 years ago Well that's different than what you asked before but ok. The president doesn't create new laws. That's the job of the legislature. Currently the republicans hold more seats in the house and in the senate there's 48 Dem, 49 Rep, and 3 Ind. So not likely to produce anything about abortion other than trying to ban it. It doesn't look like anyone else is going to be a real contender to run in Biden's place and anyone from the republican side would clearly be worse and would greenlight any anti-abortion bills that legislature would try to pass. So the obvious and adequate answer is that when Biden's term is up we are going to have to vote for him again because there are no better options and the legislature is not in a state that will work to protect pro-choice rights but is in a state where it could try to limit those rights. Also, Biden was sworn in on Jan 20th 2021 so he hasn't had 4 years yet. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Matt_Shatt@lemm.ee 5 points 3 years ago It’s a classic case of maintaining the status quo. He may not be able to codify abortion protection but he can at least stop the R’s from doing it. permalink fedilink source parent [+] DessertStorms@kbin.social -17 points 3 years ago (1 child) https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/10/14/liberalism-and-fascism-partners-in-crime/ https://blacklikemao.medium.com/how-liberalism-helps-fascism-d4dbdcb199d9 https://truthout.org/articles/fascism-is-possible-not-in-spite-of-liberal-capitalism-but-because-of-it/ https://nyanarchist.wordpress.com/2019/01/23/scratch-a-liberal-a-fascist-bleeds-how-the-so-called-middle-class-has-enabled-oppression-for-centuries/ permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago* (2 children) Don't bother, he's from lemmy.world and just wants to blame the leftists for everything. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago Acktually… I think it’s lemm.ee permalink fedilink source parent [+] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -6 points 3 years ago (1 child) Whatever you say, fash permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 4 points 3 years ago (1 child) I probably agree with your stance on abortion over all. I also generally dislike ML Communists/Leninists for their cultish indoctrination and authoritarian tendencies. But you've been way off base with this reply and the previous one in this chain. And are only serving to make yourself look bad. Something that can and has happened to all of us sometimes. Step back, take a look around, and chill. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -4 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, these fuckers called me a fascist because I'm a liberal. You want to tell someone to chill, tell them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent [–] Cyberwitch_7493@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 3 years ago* Voting is good, yes. So is protesting. We must use all the tools at our disposal, provided they are used to protect and support the most marginalized of our communities. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 53 points 3 years ago What it's going to take is to vote in Biden, then whoever the Democrats run in 2028, 2032, 2036. Until enough of the Republican justices die in office that actual jurists can replace them. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Sightline@lemmy.ml 6 points 3 years ago (2 children) That's not the only way of stopping them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Sir_Kevin@discuss.online -1 points 3 years ago This is the way. permalink fedilink source parent [+] DessertStorms@kbin.social -7 points 3 years ago (1 child) It's not even a way to stop them. Biden has literally been president during this whole Roe v Wade overturning. It's so exhausting to see libs walk this line so close to being actual progressives, but not, all for their precious capitalism. You're never going to beat the system by playing within the rules it's set you, the house always wins. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 20 points 3 years ago (1 child) Okay. Outline a reasonable action Biden could have taken to prevent the ruling. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] McNasty@sh.itjust.works 4 points 3 years ago (2 children) He could have pushed to have it codified. He could have also pushed student loan forgiveness for all borrowers instead of the bullshit means testing that got it shut down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 22 points 3 years ago (1 child) Without 60 votes in the Senate, shit, without 50, it codification of abortion rights wasn't happening. And he did push loan forgiveness, the Supreme Court shut that down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] McNasty@sh.itjust.works -14 points 3 years ago (1 child) It got shut down because of the means testing he included. If he hadn't excluded some borrowers it would have gone through. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 18 points 3 years ago Nope, it got shut down because the court ruled that it amounted to the executive appropriating money. Means testing is constitutional. permalink fedilink source parent [–] prole@sh.itjust.works 14 points 3 years ago It wasn't the means testing that shut it down, if anything it wouldn't have made it as far as it did without the means testing. As it is, people were already complaining that it was a giveaway to wealthy folks who don't need it. Take away the income limit and it would have less than zero chance of succeeding. The president has very little power over legislative decisions. Yes, he could have used the bully pulpit to advocate for abortion legislation, but it would have accomplished nothing. permalink fedilink source parent
[+] DessertStorms@kbin.social -7 points 3 years ago (1 child) It's not even a way to stop them. Biden has literally been president during this whole Roe v Wade overturning. It's so exhausting to see libs walk this line so close to being actual progressives, but not, all for their precious capitalism. You're never going to beat the system by playing within the rules it's set you, the house always wins. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 20 points 3 years ago (1 child) Okay. Outline a reasonable action Biden could have taken to prevent the ruling. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] McNasty@sh.itjust.works 4 points 3 years ago (2 children) He could have pushed to have it codified. He could have also pushed student loan forgiveness for all borrowers instead of the bullshit means testing that got it shut down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 22 points 3 years ago (1 child) Without 60 votes in the Senate, shit, without 50, it codification of abortion rights wasn't happening. And he did push loan forgiveness, the Supreme Court shut that down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] McNasty@sh.itjust.works -14 points 3 years ago (1 child) It got shut down because of the means testing he included. If he hadn't excluded some borrowers it would have gone through. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 18 points 3 years ago Nope, it got shut down because the court ruled that it amounted to the executive appropriating money. Means testing is constitutional. permalink fedilink source parent [–] prole@sh.itjust.works 14 points 3 years ago It wasn't the means testing that shut it down, if anything it wouldn't have made it as far as it did without the means testing. As it is, people were already complaining that it was a giveaway to wealthy folks who don't need it. Take away the income limit and it would have less than zero chance of succeeding. The president has very little power over legislative decisions. Yes, he could have used the bully pulpit to advocate for abortion legislation, but it would have accomplished nothing. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 20 points 3 years ago (1 child) Okay. Outline a reasonable action Biden could have taken to prevent the ruling. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] McNasty@sh.itjust.works 4 points 3 years ago (2 children) He could have pushed to have it codified. He could have also pushed student loan forgiveness for all borrowers instead of the bullshit means testing that got it shut down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 22 points 3 years ago (1 child) Without 60 votes in the Senate, shit, without 50, it codification of abortion rights wasn't happening. And he did push loan forgiveness, the Supreme Court shut that down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] McNasty@sh.itjust.works -14 points 3 years ago (1 child) It got shut down because of the means testing he included. If he hadn't excluded some borrowers it would have gone through. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 18 points 3 years ago Nope, it got shut down because the court ruled that it amounted to the executive appropriating money. Means testing is constitutional. permalink fedilink source parent [–] prole@sh.itjust.works 14 points 3 years ago It wasn't the means testing that shut it down, if anything it wouldn't have made it as far as it did without the means testing. As it is, people were already complaining that it was a giveaway to wealthy folks who don't need it. Take away the income limit and it would have less than zero chance of succeeding. The president has very little power over legislative decisions. Yes, he could have used the bully pulpit to advocate for abortion legislation, but it would have accomplished nothing. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] McNasty@sh.itjust.works 4 points 3 years ago (2 children) He could have pushed to have it codified. He could have also pushed student loan forgiveness for all borrowers instead of the bullshit means testing that got it shut down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 22 points 3 years ago (1 child) Without 60 votes in the Senate, shit, without 50, it codification of abortion rights wasn't happening. And he did push loan forgiveness, the Supreme Court shut that down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] McNasty@sh.itjust.works -14 points 3 years ago (1 child) It got shut down because of the means testing he included. If he hadn't excluded some borrowers it would have gone through. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 18 points 3 years ago Nope, it got shut down because the court ruled that it amounted to the executive appropriating money. Means testing is constitutional. permalink fedilink source parent [–] prole@sh.itjust.works 14 points 3 years ago It wasn't the means testing that shut it down, if anything it wouldn't have made it as far as it did without the means testing. As it is, people were already complaining that it was a giveaway to wealthy folks who don't need it. Take away the income limit and it would have less than zero chance of succeeding. The president has very little power over legislative decisions. Yes, he could have used the bully pulpit to advocate for abortion legislation, but it would have accomplished nothing. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 22 points 3 years ago (1 child) Without 60 votes in the Senate, shit, without 50, it codification of abortion rights wasn't happening. And he did push loan forgiveness, the Supreme Court shut that down. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] McNasty@sh.itjust.works -14 points 3 years ago (1 child) It got shut down because of the means testing he included. If he hadn't excluded some borrowers it would have gone through. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 18 points 3 years ago Nope, it got shut down because the court ruled that it amounted to the executive appropriating money. Means testing is constitutional. permalink fedilink source parent
[+] McNasty@sh.itjust.works -14 points 3 years ago (1 child) It got shut down because of the means testing he included. If he hadn't excluded some borrowers it would have gone through. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 18 points 3 years ago Nope, it got shut down because the court ruled that it amounted to the executive appropriating money. Means testing is constitutional. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 18 points 3 years ago Nope, it got shut down because the court ruled that it amounted to the executive appropriating money. Means testing is constitutional. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] prole@sh.itjust.works 14 points 3 years ago It wasn't the means testing that shut it down, if anything it wouldn't have made it as far as it did without the means testing. As it is, people were already complaining that it was a giveaway to wealthy folks who don't need it. Take away the income limit and it would have less than zero chance of succeeding. The president has very little power over legislative decisions. Yes, he could have used the bully pulpit to advocate for abortion legislation, but it would have accomplished nothing. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml 2 points 3 years ago (2 children) Why can't Biden do something to safeguard abortion in his current term? If he can't do something on his current term, why will he be able to do something on his next one? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 30 points 3 years ago (1 child) Biden doesn't have the authority to safeguard abortion. He had the authority to veto Congress. Biden would veto a nationwide abortion ban. Trump or any other Republican would not. Additionally, presidents appoint supreme Court justices in the event of a vacancy, or if Congress ever gets on board for expanding the court.. do we'd need a Democrat in office if we're ever going to reverse Dobbs. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -3 points 3 years ago (1 child) Can't he do it temporarily via executive order? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 16 points 3 years ago No. It isn't in the scope of executive powers. If there was a national law protecting the right to abortion, he could use executive orders to enforce that. But that isn't the world we live in anymore. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RecursiveParadox@lemmy.world 25 points 3 years ago (1 child) It would take an act of congress, and the D's don't have the votes. Shitty but true. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Don't bother, he's from Lemmygrad and just wants to blame the Democrats for everything permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml 0 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, I'm not even from the US. My question is, in my opinion, an obvious one, at least to an outsider to the US political system. Why do you have to vote him again, when he's in power now? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 15 points 3 years ago* His presidential subscription needs to be re-upped every Summer Olympics permalink fedilink source parent [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 14 points 3 years ago (1 child) Because presidents serve for a limited number of years. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Of which he had 4 in total to do something about abortions, so I fail to see how that's an adequate answer permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 13 points 3 years ago Well that's different than what you asked before but ok. The president doesn't create new laws. That's the job of the legislature. Currently the republicans hold more seats in the house and in the senate there's 48 Dem, 49 Rep, and 3 Ind. So not likely to produce anything about abortion other than trying to ban it. It doesn't look like anyone else is going to be a real contender to run in Biden's place and anyone from the republican side would clearly be worse and would greenlight any anti-abortion bills that legislature would try to pass. So the obvious and adequate answer is that when Biden's term is up we are going to have to vote for him again because there are no better options and the legislature is not in a state that will work to protect pro-choice rights but is in a state where it could try to limit those rights. Also, Biden was sworn in on Jan 20th 2021 so he hasn't had 4 years yet. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Matt_Shatt@lemm.ee 5 points 3 years ago It’s a classic case of maintaining the status quo. He may not be able to codify abortion protection but he can at least stop the R’s from doing it. permalink fedilink source parent [+] DessertStorms@kbin.social -17 points 3 years ago (1 child) https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/10/14/liberalism-and-fascism-partners-in-crime/ https://blacklikemao.medium.com/how-liberalism-helps-fascism-d4dbdcb199d9 https://truthout.org/articles/fascism-is-possible-not-in-spite-of-liberal-capitalism-but-because-of-it/ https://nyanarchist.wordpress.com/2019/01/23/scratch-a-liberal-a-fascist-bleeds-how-the-so-called-middle-class-has-enabled-oppression-for-centuries/ permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago* (2 children) Don't bother, he's from lemmy.world and just wants to blame the leftists for everything. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago Acktually… I think it’s lemm.ee permalink fedilink source parent [+] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -6 points 3 years ago (1 child) Whatever you say, fash permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 4 points 3 years ago (1 child) I probably agree with your stance on abortion over all. I also generally dislike ML Communists/Leninists for their cultish indoctrination and authoritarian tendencies. But you've been way off base with this reply and the previous one in this chain. And are only serving to make yourself look bad. Something that can and has happened to all of us sometimes. Step back, take a look around, and chill. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -4 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, these fuckers called me a fascist because I'm a liberal. You want to tell someone to chill, tell them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 30 points 3 years ago (1 child) Biden doesn't have the authority to safeguard abortion. He had the authority to veto Congress. Biden would veto a nationwide abortion ban. Trump or any other Republican would not. Additionally, presidents appoint supreme Court justices in the event of a vacancy, or if Congress ever gets on board for expanding the court.. do we'd need a Democrat in office if we're ever going to reverse Dobbs. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -3 points 3 years ago (1 child) Can't he do it temporarily via executive order? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 16 points 3 years ago No. It isn't in the scope of executive powers. If there was a national law protecting the right to abortion, he could use executive orders to enforce that. But that isn't the world we live in anymore. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -3 points 3 years ago (1 child) Can't he do it temporarily via executive order? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 16 points 3 years ago No. It isn't in the scope of executive powers. If there was a national law protecting the right to abortion, he could use executive orders to enforce that. But that isn't the world we live in anymore. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] flossdaily@lemmy.world 16 points 3 years ago No. It isn't in the scope of executive powers. If there was a national law protecting the right to abortion, he could use executive orders to enforce that. But that isn't the world we live in anymore. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] RecursiveParadox@lemmy.world 25 points 3 years ago (1 child) It would take an act of congress, and the D's don't have the votes. Shitty but true. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Don't bother, he's from Lemmygrad and just wants to blame the Democrats for everything permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml 0 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, I'm not even from the US. My question is, in my opinion, an obvious one, at least to an outsider to the US political system. Why do you have to vote him again, when he's in power now? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 15 points 3 years ago* His presidential subscription needs to be re-upped every Summer Olympics permalink fedilink source parent [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 14 points 3 years ago (1 child) Because presidents serve for a limited number of years. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Of which he had 4 in total to do something about abortions, so I fail to see how that's an adequate answer permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 13 points 3 years ago Well that's different than what you asked before but ok. The president doesn't create new laws. That's the job of the legislature. Currently the republicans hold more seats in the house and in the senate there's 48 Dem, 49 Rep, and 3 Ind. So not likely to produce anything about abortion other than trying to ban it. It doesn't look like anyone else is going to be a real contender to run in Biden's place and anyone from the republican side would clearly be worse and would greenlight any anti-abortion bills that legislature would try to pass. So the obvious and adequate answer is that when Biden's term is up we are going to have to vote for him again because there are no better options and the legislature is not in a state that will work to protect pro-choice rights but is in a state where it could try to limit those rights. Also, Biden was sworn in on Jan 20th 2021 so he hasn't had 4 years yet. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Matt_Shatt@lemm.ee 5 points 3 years ago It’s a classic case of maintaining the status quo. He may not be able to codify abortion protection but he can at least stop the R’s from doing it. permalink fedilink source parent [+] DessertStorms@kbin.social -17 points 3 years ago (1 child) https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/10/14/liberalism-and-fascism-partners-in-crime/ https://blacklikemao.medium.com/how-liberalism-helps-fascism-d4dbdcb199d9 https://truthout.org/articles/fascism-is-possible-not-in-spite-of-liberal-capitalism-but-because-of-it/ https://nyanarchist.wordpress.com/2019/01/23/scratch-a-liberal-a-fascist-bleeds-how-the-so-called-middle-class-has-enabled-oppression-for-centuries/ permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago* (2 children) Don't bother, he's from lemmy.world and just wants to blame the leftists for everything. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago Acktually… I think it’s lemm.ee permalink fedilink source parent [+] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -6 points 3 years ago (1 child) Whatever you say, fash permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 4 points 3 years ago (1 child) I probably agree with your stance on abortion over all. I also generally dislike ML Communists/Leninists for their cultish indoctrination and authoritarian tendencies. But you've been way off base with this reply and the previous one in this chain. And are only serving to make yourself look bad. Something that can and has happened to all of us sometimes. Step back, take a look around, and chill. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -4 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, these fuckers called me a fascist because I'm a liberal. You want to tell someone to chill, tell them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Don't bother, he's from Lemmygrad and just wants to blame the Democrats for everything permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml 0 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, I'm not even from the US. My question is, in my opinion, an obvious one, at least to an outsider to the US political system. Why do you have to vote him again, when he's in power now? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 15 points 3 years ago* His presidential subscription needs to be re-upped every Summer Olympics permalink fedilink source parent [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 14 points 3 years ago (1 child) Because presidents serve for a limited number of years. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Of which he had 4 in total to do something about abortions, so I fail to see how that's an adequate answer permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 13 points 3 years ago Well that's different than what you asked before but ok. The president doesn't create new laws. That's the job of the legislature. Currently the republicans hold more seats in the house and in the senate there's 48 Dem, 49 Rep, and 3 Ind. So not likely to produce anything about abortion other than trying to ban it. It doesn't look like anyone else is going to be a real contender to run in Biden's place and anyone from the republican side would clearly be worse and would greenlight any anti-abortion bills that legislature would try to pass. So the obvious and adequate answer is that when Biden's term is up we are going to have to vote for him again because there are no better options and the legislature is not in a state that will work to protect pro-choice rights but is in a state where it could try to limit those rights. Also, Biden was sworn in on Jan 20th 2021 so he hasn't had 4 years yet. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Matt_Shatt@lemm.ee 5 points 3 years ago It’s a classic case of maintaining the status quo. He may not be able to codify abortion protection but he can at least stop the R’s from doing it. permalink fedilink source parent [+] DessertStorms@kbin.social -17 points 3 years ago (1 child) https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/10/14/liberalism-and-fascism-partners-in-crime/ https://blacklikemao.medium.com/how-liberalism-helps-fascism-d4dbdcb199d9 https://truthout.org/articles/fascism-is-possible-not-in-spite-of-liberal-capitalism-but-because-of-it/ https://nyanarchist.wordpress.com/2019/01/23/scratch-a-liberal-a-fascist-bleeds-how-the-so-called-middle-class-has-enabled-oppression-for-centuries/ permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago* (2 children) Don't bother, he's from lemmy.world and just wants to blame the leftists for everything. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago Acktually… I think it’s lemm.ee permalink fedilink source parent [+] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -6 points 3 years ago (1 child) Whatever you say, fash permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 4 points 3 years ago (1 child) I probably agree with your stance on abortion over all. I also generally dislike ML Communists/Leninists for their cultish indoctrination and authoritarian tendencies. But you've been way off base with this reply and the previous one in this chain. And are only serving to make yourself look bad. Something that can and has happened to all of us sometimes. Step back, take a look around, and chill. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -4 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, these fuckers called me a fascist because I'm a liberal. You want to tell someone to chill, tell them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml 0 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, I'm not even from the US. My question is, in my opinion, an obvious one, at least to an outsider to the US political system. Why do you have to vote him again, when he's in power now? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 15 points 3 years ago* His presidential subscription needs to be re-upped every Summer Olympics permalink fedilink source parent [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 14 points 3 years ago (1 child) Because presidents serve for a limited number of years. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Of which he had 4 in total to do something about abortions, so I fail to see how that's an adequate answer permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 13 points 3 years ago Well that's different than what you asked before but ok. The president doesn't create new laws. That's the job of the legislature. Currently the republicans hold more seats in the house and in the senate there's 48 Dem, 49 Rep, and 3 Ind. So not likely to produce anything about abortion other than trying to ban it. It doesn't look like anyone else is going to be a real contender to run in Biden's place and anyone from the republican side would clearly be worse and would greenlight any anti-abortion bills that legislature would try to pass. So the obvious and adequate answer is that when Biden's term is up we are going to have to vote for him again because there are no better options and the legislature is not in a state that will work to protect pro-choice rights but is in a state where it could try to limit those rights. Also, Biden was sworn in on Jan 20th 2021 so he hasn't had 4 years yet. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Matt_Shatt@lemm.ee 5 points 3 years ago It’s a classic case of maintaining the status quo. He may not be able to codify abortion protection but he can at least stop the R’s from doing it. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] derpo@lemmy.world 15 points 3 years ago* His presidential subscription needs to be re-upped every Summer Olympics permalink fedilink source parent
[–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 14 points 3 years ago (1 child) Because presidents serve for a limited number of years. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Of which he had 4 in total to do something about abortions, so I fail to see how that's an adequate answer permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 13 points 3 years ago Well that's different than what you asked before but ok. The president doesn't create new laws. That's the job of the legislature. Currently the republicans hold more seats in the house and in the senate there's 48 Dem, 49 Rep, and 3 Ind. So not likely to produce anything about abortion other than trying to ban it. It doesn't look like anyone else is going to be a real contender to run in Biden's place and anyone from the republican side would clearly be worse and would greenlight any anti-abortion bills that legislature would try to pass. So the obvious and adequate answer is that when Biden's term is up we are going to have to vote for him again because there are no better options and the legislature is not in a state that will work to protect pro-choice rights but is in a state where it could try to limit those rights. Also, Biden was sworn in on Jan 20th 2021 so he hasn't had 4 years yet. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Matt_Shatt@lemm.ee 5 points 3 years ago It’s a classic case of maintaining the status quo. He may not be able to codify abortion protection but he can at least stop the R’s from doing it. permalink fedilink source parent
[+] sevenapples@lemmygrad.ml -10 points 3 years ago (2 children) Of which he had 4 in total to do something about abortions, so I fail to see how that's an adequate answer permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 13 points 3 years ago Well that's different than what you asked before but ok. The president doesn't create new laws. That's the job of the legislature. Currently the republicans hold more seats in the house and in the senate there's 48 Dem, 49 Rep, and 3 Ind. So not likely to produce anything about abortion other than trying to ban it. It doesn't look like anyone else is going to be a real contender to run in Biden's place and anyone from the republican side would clearly be worse and would greenlight any anti-abortion bills that legislature would try to pass. So the obvious and adequate answer is that when Biden's term is up we are going to have to vote for him again because there are no better options and the legislature is not in a state that will work to protect pro-choice rights but is in a state where it could try to limit those rights. Also, Biden was sworn in on Jan 20th 2021 so he hasn't had 4 years yet. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Matt_Shatt@lemm.ee 5 points 3 years ago It’s a classic case of maintaining the status quo. He may not be able to codify abortion protection but he can at least stop the R’s from doing it. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] magnusrufus@lemmy.world 13 points 3 years ago Well that's different than what you asked before but ok. The president doesn't create new laws. That's the job of the legislature. Currently the republicans hold more seats in the house and in the senate there's 48 Dem, 49 Rep, and 3 Ind. So not likely to produce anything about abortion other than trying to ban it. It doesn't look like anyone else is going to be a real contender to run in Biden's place and anyone from the republican side would clearly be worse and would greenlight any anti-abortion bills that legislature would try to pass. So the obvious and adequate answer is that when Biden's term is up we are going to have to vote for him again because there are no better options and the legislature is not in a state that will work to protect pro-choice rights but is in a state where it could try to limit those rights. Also, Biden was sworn in on Jan 20th 2021 so he hasn't had 4 years yet. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Matt_Shatt@lemm.ee 5 points 3 years ago It’s a classic case of maintaining the status quo. He may not be able to codify abortion protection but he can at least stop the R’s from doing it. permalink fedilink source parent
[+] DessertStorms@kbin.social -17 points 3 years ago (1 child) https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/10/14/liberalism-and-fascism-partners-in-crime/ https://blacklikemao.medium.com/how-liberalism-helps-fascism-d4dbdcb199d9 https://truthout.org/articles/fascism-is-possible-not-in-spite-of-liberal-capitalism-but-because-of-it/ https://nyanarchist.wordpress.com/2019/01/23/scratch-a-liberal-a-fascist-bleeds-how-the-so-called-middle-class-has-enabled-oppression-for-centuries/ permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago* (2 children) Don't bother, he's from lemmy.world and just wants to blame the leftists for everything. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago Acktually… I think it’s lemm.ee permalink fedilink source parent [+] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -6 points 3 years ago (1 child) Whatever you say, fash permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 4 points 3 years ago (1 child) I probably agree with your stance on abortion over all. I also generally dislike ML Communists/Leninists for their cultish indoctrination and authoritarian tendencies. But you've been way off base with this reply and the previous one in this chain. And are only serving to make yourself look bad. Something that can and has happened to all of us sometimes. Step back, take a look around, and chill. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -4 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, these fuckers called me a fascist because I'm a liberal. You want to tell someone to chill, tell them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago* (2 children) Don't bother, he's from lemmy.world and just wants to blame the leftists for everything. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] derpo@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago Acktually… I think it’s lemm.ee permalink fedilink source parent [+] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -6 points 3 years ago (1 child) Whatever you say, fash permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 4 points 3 years ago (1 child) I probably agree with your stance on abortion over all. I also generally dislike ML Communists/Leninists for their cultish indoctrination and authoritarian tendencies. But you've been way off base with this reply and the previous one in this chain. And are only serving to make yourself look bad. Something that can and has happened to all of us sometimes. Step back, take a look around, and chill. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -4 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, these fuckers called me a fascist because I'm a liberal. You want to tell someone to chill, tell them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] derpo@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago Acktually… I think it’s lemm.ee permalink fedilink source parent
[+] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -6 points 3 years ago (1 child) Whatever you say, fash permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 4 points 3 years ago (1 child) I probably agree with your stance on abortion over all. I also generally dislike ML Communists/Leninists for their cultish indoctrination and authoritarian tendencies. But you've been way off base with this reply and the previous one in this chain. And are only serving to make yourself look bad. Something that can and has happened to all of us sometimes. Step back, take a look around, and chill. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -4 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, these fuckers called me a fascist because I'm a liberal. You want to tell someone to chill, tell them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 4 points 3 years ago (1 child) I probably agree with your stance on abortion over all. I also generally dislike ML Communists/Leninists for their cultish indoctrination and authoritarian tendencies. But you've been way off base with this reply and the previous one in this chain. And are only serving to make yourself look bad. Something that can and has happened to all of us sometimes. Step back, take a look around, and chill. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -4 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, these fuckers called me a fascist because I'm a liberal. You want to tell someone to chill, tell them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -4 points 3 years ago (2 children) Dude, these fuckers called me a fascist because I'm a liberal. You want to tell someone to chill, tell them. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 3 points 3 years ago* No one in this thread called you a fascist you little baby. Someone from a different country asked you an honest question and you turned it into a self-pity party. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) No one did. And even if they did that wasn't the only thing I was talking about. There are valid criticisms about all ideologies especially liberalism. I may not agree with the extremism and hypocrisy that they attack it with. But sometimes your enemies or people you just don't like do have a point. Separate yourself from the system and stop being offended for it. You aren't an ideology. You're more complex and more flexible than that. Just like other people. Sometimes we all forget that though. You started out attacking the messenger. Not the message. Yeah I think lemmygrad is a toxic place, and wouldn't associate with it. But, that had no real bearing on what the person said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee -1 points 3 years ago* (1 child) https://kbin.social/m/news@lemmy.world/t/343213/-/comment/1636453 Four links calling me a fascist. And I'm happy to analyze criticisms made in good faith, using the words of the person I'm talking to. Link-dumping ideological screeds against liberals from smug leftists who sit on their asses and declare that I'm the same as a Republican when I'm pushing for progress and they're just fantasizing about what would be possible if only everyone agreed with them? That, I am not open to. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) What did I just finish saying. You are a person not an ideology. And if those articles really are written about you personally. Perhaps should do some introspection. No I believe you're just engaging in hyperbole at the moment. But tell me you don't have the self-awareness to see the irony in someone basically doing to you what you did to the lemmygrad poster. Which again, I don't like lemmygrad. But you're critique of that poster was rather equally extreme and uncalled for. It's silly were even having this discussion at this point. Because I asure you for the topic this whole thread of posts is founded upon. You both probably agree far more than you disagree. And both your energies should be turned towards the people who made this a possibility. Not each other. Hell I'd say you both probably have a lot more in common than you think. It's clear you've reduced them to the ideology of leninism. And you strongly identify yourself as a liberal. You are both adherence to largely failed ideologies. So you have that in common. I Kidd. But seriously. All of this is wasted drama and effort. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) Yeah, look, man, I'm open to working with anyone in coalition, even if I disagree with them. That's why I'm a liberal. People who call me a fascist for joining that kind of coalition, they aren't open to working with me. I've interacted quite a lot with people like that. They don't want collaboration, they want capitulation on every topic so they can dictate events. Except there's five billion different ways that the various people in those communities want to dictate events, so there's not even an avenue towards uniting people in a functional coalition. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 1 point 3 years ago (1 child) As a socialist (social democrat/true libertarian) ish I don't totally disagree with you. However the question seemed pretty innocuous and even sincere. You came in a bit hot. I've done it too. And probably will do it again at some point. But when we do that it just drives us apart and causes everyone else to behave extremely too. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago (1 child) I get what you're saying. What I'm saying is that when someone has already decided that I'm the same as a Republican because I'm a social liberal, then there's really not much of a point in anything beyond mocking them for being unrealistic and trying to play for the audience. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Eldritch@lemmy.world 2 points 3 years ago (1 child) Do you deny that many democrats/liberals have over the years acquiesced and even assisted in bad Republican legislation? That's not a controversial thing to point out. They have. And look even you are giving qualifiers now. Calling yourself a socially liberal. Which is something very different from economic liberalism. Which is what generally people are talking about when they talk about liberals. If I had to Hazard a guess. I would say that you are honestly pro-social democracy more than you are a liberal. And in fact on many economic issues would actually be more on the left with the rest of the Socialist then you would most economic right wing liberals. Just something to consider. Anyhow I've said my piece. And it seems the actual extremist and downvote Squad have showed up. We had a pretty reasonable conversation but getting downvoted I don't see the point and continuing it anymore have a good day. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cleverdawny@lemm.ee 0 points 3 years ago* https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cyberwitch_7493@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 3 years ago* Voting is good, yes. So is protesting. We must use all the tools at our disposal, provided they are used to protect and support the most marginalized of our communities. permalink fedilink source parent