Data Is Beautiful

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[–] OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml -2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 child)

Easy, I use political science terms and traditional analysis

I literally use "liberal" to mean liberal capitalist because I read political economics books. When you say "political science" and "traditional analysis" you are referring to something that is a lot less universal than you think it is.

Also like how do you talk about liberalism and neoliberalism in a non confusing way while also claiming liberalism is left? You didn't answer my question you just took a swipe.

The important thing to remember is that liberal vs. conservative is an ideological midpoint for the discourse being discussed and/or measured

Except this is a very narrow overton window(more like an arrow slit) and if you limit your discussion to it you miss a lot of context and analysis.

Which is good, because the overall trend throughout history is leftward and a relative system is able to both capture that as well as provide descriptive value for a given measurement period.

This is kinda unfalsifiable

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[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 years ago (1 child)

Also like how do you talk about liberalism and neoliberalism in a non confusing way while also claiming liberalism is left?

You make it clear with your audience that you're talking about the "liberal" in the economic sense and not "liberal" in the philosophical sense. From a philosophical perspective is the difference between being pro changes (liberal) vs being against changes (conservative), and as the person previously mentioned, in this sense you could say there are conservative communists (want to follow Marx's philosophy to the letter) and liberal communists (believe in the basic principles but feel some things need to be adjusted), just like there are liberal conservatives (believe in small/efficient State but individual freedoms) and conservative conservatives (social conservatives).

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[–] OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml -2 points 2 years ago (1 child)

You make it clear with your audience that you’re talking about the “liberal” in the economic sense and not “liberal” in the philosophical sense.

Liberalism as a philosophy is connected to the economic structure? Are you referring to a different philosophy and calling it liberal?

From a philosophical perspective is the difference between being pro changes (liberal) vs being against changes (conservative)

Okay, yes, you are. Liberalism is literally the status quo.

in this sense you could say there are conservative communists (want to follow Marx’s philosophy to the letter) and liberal communists (believe in the basic principles but feel some things need to be adjusted)

You literally can't be a marxist and take Marx as dogma. Marxism is a process based ideology.

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https://www.diffen.com/difference/Conservative_vs_Liberal

[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

There, maybe you'll manage to understand if we dumb it down for you 🙂

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[–] OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml 0 points 2 years ago* (1 child)

The issue is that your definition is "dumbed down" to the point that it loses utility when discussing politics and conceals cultural hegemony.

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[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 child)

No it doesn't because, you just have to specify what you mean because the word has multiple definitions and in OP's example it's the definition I've provided that's being used and you should have known because of the context (liberalism as opposed to conservatism).

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[–] OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml 0 points 2 years ago (1 child)

Of course the word has multiple definitions, that definition just obscures the shit out of everything and isn't very useful. It literally obscures that conservatives are also liberals (in the more meaningful sense) and obscures the difference between left and liberal.

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[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 years ago (1 child)

It literally obscures that conservatives are also liberals (in the more meaningful sense) and obscures the difference between left and liberal.

Only if you use another definition of the word.

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[–] OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml -1 points 2 years ago (1 child)

How do you talk about liberal hegemony (marxist definition) while using the nonsense definition in a non-bulky way?

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[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 years ago (1 child)

First of all, I already answered that question many times and second of all, you calling it a "nonsense" definition shows that you're just arguing in bad faith because you're not ready to accept that you just didn't know that the word has multiple definitions depending on context.

Good night.

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[–] OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml -1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

No, no you haven't, you've just been smug.

But I'm glad we are the point of the pigeon shitting all over the board and flying away, if that is how you insist on acting.

you’re just arguing in bad faith because you’re not ready to accept that you just didn’t know that the word has multiple definitions depending on context.

Do you think anyone born in the US doesn't know the most common definition? The rejection of it is because it is a bad definition that serves to obscure how politics actually functions. I also literally reference this, but you insist that I dont know that words can have multiple meanings. Who is arguing in bad faith?