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Iranians set fire to the flags of Israel and the United States, as well as an obelisk and a statue of Baal which they described as a symbol of Satan in response to release of the Epstein documents. (lemmy.ml)
submitted 6 months ago by to c/worldnews@lemmy.ml
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Today, in a symbolic act, Iranians set fire to the flags of Israel and the United States, as well as an obelisk and a statue of Baal—which they described as a symbol of Satan—in various cities across Iran in response to the release of the Epstein documents.

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[–] 2 points 6 months ago (1 child)

Saying that polytheism and monotheism are actually the same thing and therefore they're burning their own god is quite a large stretch.

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  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    I didn't say that. Yahweh used to be a part of a polytheistic religion and over time became the only god. That doesn't make polytheism and monotheism the same thing, but it does make Allah and God the same god as the Yahweh from the original polytheistic religion.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    Linguistically they seem to use a word for "God" but that is about where the similarities seem to end. A quick search shows your theory being a prominent Quota answer which usually isn't a great indicator of truthfulness, but also it claims Baal and Yahweh being two entirely different polytheistic gods and then Yahweh winning out over time (at least according to some rando on Quota). So even following that line they aren't the same and Iran isn't "burning their own God."

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  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    YHWH was originally the Caanite desert warrior and storm God, according to YouTube Esoterica, run by Dr. Justin Sledge, who is Jewish and has excellent deep-dive videos on that channel. These are subjects deeply interesting to me as I started my own faith and have had to turn increasingly to Judaism and the suppressed books taken from the same Dead Sea scrolls as Gnosticism, found at Qum Ran, and included in the Ethiopian Bible, which you can find in English, also on YouTube and elsewhere online, with digging.

    Basically, the Council of Nicea worked for Constantine, who had a political interest in regular people not getting ideas to violently uprise against his authority, much like slavers giving slaves a different version of the Bible than the slavers read.

    It's been quite an enlightening, years-long journey, learning how much words or phrases were mistranslated from Aramaic to Greek and Latin, deliberately, or from misunderstanding, which were then mistranslated again, into English. Multiple scribes with their own biases and fallibities, as were, I would imagine, Jewish scribes before them, in addition to how tales change from one telling to the next, for multiple generations. The person to whom you are replying is probably closer to correct than incorrect, and quora, like Reddit and Lemmy, can get things right, wrong, or an amalgamation, according to their own writers' understandings and biases. Here, I've cited my sources so it's a rather fascinating and winding journey, if you're ever inclined to go digging. I'm saying this as someone who regularly disagrees with the person to whom you replied here as often as I've agreed with you, so it's not that I'm choosing their side based on personal feelings, for whatever that's worth or not.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago* (1 child)

    Thanks for the context. It was also iffy because it gives credence to the implication that Iran is burning Ba'al because he represents Yaweh and therefore Zionists can say "Iran is antisemitic".

    I did a little more research and found a Reddit thread where everyone really just seems to make random stuff up https://www.reddit.com/r/DebateReligion/comments/hu3gvu/yahweh_and_baal_the_same_deity/

    But even there the seeming most sensible comment says that Baal and Yaweh were two different deities.

    In ancient times Baal is a term for various deities in the West Semitic (Syrian and Levantine) area and means Lord, master, owner, husband, king or god. Baal was a title that could be used for any god. Baal is usually referred to as the supreme god of the local pantheon. He is usually a god of mountains, weather and fertility. The Babylonian weather god Adad was often equated with Baal.

    In the Bible, the term Baal is used synonymously as a name for a number of local deities, but the Hebrew word Baal also appears in the Bible in its non-religious meaning Lord, owner or husband.

    According to the biblical account, the Israelites came into contact with the cult of Baal during the desert migration (Dtn 25:3). In the narratives a sharp contrast is usually emphasized. On the other hand, names containing Baal show that in the early days of Israel, the worship of JHWH and Baal was not perceived as a contrast: Saul named his first son Jonathan (YH gave), another Ishbaal (man of Baal). David named one son Adoniah: My Lord is YH), another Beeljada (Baal has recognized, 1 Chr 14:7).

    Baal was worshipped for centuries, especially in northern Israel (1 Kings 16:32); both the Elijah legends and the Book of Hosea polemicize against and call for monolatrous YHWH worship instead. Hosea 2:18 suggests that the word Baal (according to its original etymology) was previously used as a title for YHWH itself (which the prophet opposes for several reasons). Its worship in Northern Israel can be explained at least in part by the cultural and religious influence of Tyros.

    The biggest connection people seem to find is that one is called "The Lord" and the other one "God" but it still all feels like a very large stretch to me. Thanks for your input though I don't really feel like spending more time on this subject but I might check out the Youtube channel in the future.

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  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago

    You're welcome, and thank you for that reddit post! It's quite fascinating and largely aligns with my current understanding. Part of the reason for yhwh allowing the conquering and exiles of the Jewish people was for "whoring after other gods" and Baal was one of several. In this context, the "covenant" between yhwh and his people meant "marriage" so the Hebrews worshipping other gods was adultery, punishable by death, so conquering, exile, and occupation was indicative of G-d's mercy on his people, because of his love and compassion.

    If you do a deeper dive, some of the Hollywood movies begin to make more sense, and even deeper will change your understanding of the various names of G-d, akin to the Brahmans' saying, "Brahma is one, the faces of Brahma are many." Deeper still and you learn how modern Christianity also corrupted the common understanding of souls, the tree of life (and tree of death), the shattering of the vessels (mazel tov!) and so. much. more!

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