938
If Russia is fighting against Nazis in Ukraine (sopuli.xyz)
submitted 8 months ago by to c/politicalmemes@lemmy.world
141 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] 3 points 8 months ago (1 child)

I think they're just in a cult though, which is the only explanation for why they all seem to be trying to be as difficult to communicate with as possible, as if they're all trying to get people to hate whatever they're pretending to stand for which they also rarily can elaborate on.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 4 points 8 months ago (3 children)

    I’ve been accused of being a tankie before and I don’t think my accuser even knew what they meant by tankie. We certainly weren’t discussing the USSR’s decision to send in tanks to Hungary in the 1950’s, which is where the term originated.

    I am also not a supporter of Putin’s war of aggression, although I do understand why he thought the war was necessary, and agree that those reasons are real (not saying that the war was necessary, just saying that Putin is not a lunatic). I also offer critical support to any country that takes a stand against the western hegemony, particularly if their stance is against the capitalist exploitation perpetrated by the west around the world, since I am a communist.

    However, never has a person who uses the term “tankie” ever actually engaged in an open discussion about those beliefs. “Tankie” is a conversation ender that kills all subsequent thought the minute someone throws it out.

    With those experiences, is it any wonder that people you call tankies don’t engage in conversation with you? Why would they, when they have no expectation of even being heard?

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 6 child comments
    •
  • [–] 5 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah, you're not a tankie. I've seen people on here essentially saying Russia is doing completely normal things right now, definitely not corrupt, and it's citizens are not being lied to. They're tankies

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 5 points 8 months ago

    And yet I’ve been banned from certain comms that have no tankies rules simply for stating I’m a communist. That’s why I say it’s a thought-killer. People who use tankie generally don’t allow themselves to see any nuance around anything that has any whiff of communism. (Which is getting a little off topic, as Russia definitely has nothing to do with communism now.)

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • [–] -1 points 8 months ago

    However, never has a person who uses the term “tankie” ever actually engaged in an open discussion about those beliefs. “Tankie” is a conversation ender that kills all subsequent thought the minute someone throws it out.

    Many people, especially on this site, self identify as tankies. They also have utterly unreasonable view points that are against any gradual change and think any positive change must be as a result of an instant bloody revolution they also won't personally fight in or start.

    The fact that you tried to use the term they personally identify as a way to dismiss my criticisms and pretend it was I that was being the problem speaks to you not actually wanting to address the point I'm making.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • [–] -3 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    I am also not a supporter of Putin’s war of aggression, although I do understand why he thought the war was necessary, and agree that those reasons are real (not saying that the war was necessary, just saying that Putin is not a lunatic).

    Since you understand the Russian POV that big countries have spheres of influence that they control and little countries do not have agency, then you obviously also agree that the Americas are within the US sphere of influence and understand why they did all the coups that they did (not saying they were necessary, just saying that the US is not any more imperialist than Russia)?

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    That’s a nice straw man, but not at all representative of the Russian POV. In their minds, they are America during the Cuban missile crisis. NATO, an organization that has positioned itself expressly as enemies of Russia, has been building up military presence on Russia’s doorstep. Simultaneously, following the Maidan coup, Russian nationals were targeted for oppression by far-right Ukrainian state elements as well as Nazi paramilitaries. Those are Russia’s stated reasons for the war, and they are based on facts.

    Now, I don’t think those reasons justify a war of aggression, and Ukraine’s Nazi problem largely seems to be resolved, especially since Zelenskyy took power, but those are the real reasons the war started.

    Pretty incomparable to the USA’s interventions, whose targets never posed a threat to American lives or national security.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] -3 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    I can see why people say you're a tanking considering how you're literally parroting Russian talking points and having a suspiciously large amount of understanding for the excuses of Russian imperialism while not sharing the understanding with other imperialist nations.

    At least we both agree that the correct solution to the Cuban missile crisis was the invasion and genocide of Cuba, or something.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    You are literally proving my point. You refuse to engage with any facts that go against the narrative of “Russia bad” while using a slur in an attempt to discredit me.

    Also, it’s ridiculous to imply that just because I understand something, that means I support it. As usual, the anti-communist resorts to lies and slander.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] -2 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    I'm refusing to engage with "facts" that are false. Russia is currently engaging in a genocidal war of aggression. They are bad.

    Also, it’s ridiculous to imply that just because I understand something, that means I support it.

    That's what I'm saying. I'm not saying you're a tankie because you're parroting false Russian propaganda talking points, I'm just saying I understand why people are saying that you are one. You know, the exact same thing that you're doing where you're trying to mask your support of Russia by saying you don't support it, but you do understand it.

    Also, it’s ridiculous to imply that just because I understand something, that means I support it.

    I don't disagree with this. I disagree with your assertion that you understand the reasons for the war.

    while using a slur

    1. Tankie is not a slur.
    2. I didn't call you a tankie.
  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (1 child)

    You should do more investigation, because your understanding of the facts does not align with reality. I recommend starting with Michael Parenti's "Manufacturing Consent" to understand how western media has shaped your worldview and understanding of history.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] -1 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    You don't agree that Russia is waging a genocidal war of aggression right now? Because even according to their own media they are.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Two things can be true. Russia could have had legitimate concerns about escalators actions by NATO, and simultaneously their decision to wage war over those reasons could be wrong and illegal. Also, Russia has certainly committed war crimes and crimes against humanity.

    However, I’m done talking with you. This entire conversation you have used straw men, lied, cherry-picked points, and moved goalposts. You don’t argue in good faith, you’re just trying to win.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 0 points 7 months ago

    Russia could have had legitimate concerns about escalators actions by NATO,

    Do you think the invasion of Georgia or the initial invasion of Ukraine was an "escalatory action"?

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent