▲ 362 ▼ TSA announces $45 fee for travelers with no REAL ID (abcnews.go.com) submitted 8 months ago by fne8w2ah@lemmy.world to c/news@lemmy.world 127 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[–] AbidanYre@lemmy.world 77 points 8 months ago (2 children) We still need to go through the process to make sure that we verify who you are As long as I don't have any weapons it shouldn't matter. permalink fedilink source hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] NaibofTabr@infosec.pub 48 points 8 months ago (2 children) but how else will we track where everyone is all the time permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 15 points 8 months ago* (4 children) Unless you are using a fake ID and fake credit card then they already have that data? They know John Smith who lives at 123 Main Street in Bumbfuck, WI and who paid with credit card 1234567890123456 is flying from MSN to LAX on December 1st, 2025 and returning via the same route on December 3rd, 2025. The RealID requirements are to, theoretically, streamline the process of matching person to face with more standardized ID requirements. Like all ID related legislature there is good and bad there. But if your focus is on The Man tracking you? This changes nothing unless you are already actively committing fraud at MANY levels. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] flandish@lemmy.world 19 points 8 months ago (1 child) neat. there is no reason they even need an id. do you need one to gain access to the highways? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -4 points 8 months ago* (1 child) Most highways are publicly accessible (and still log you with a Flock(TM) camera anyway...). But if you want to use the priority lane in states like Colorado? Yeah, they need to scan your pass and they very much do. The ID still matches the face/body to the Person. Its no different than checking if you are the person with a reservation at a hotel. That said, you can bet there is work in place to not actually need it through a mix of facial ID and profiling. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] flandish@lemmy.world 13 points 8 months ago (1 child) that’s my point. outside of a thin lane or three, which is probably considerable “private” - public infra should be accessible. Last I checked (abt six months ago) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. it’s all just a cash grab and control theater / normalization at airports. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains, except of course: profit. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. Because those are public roads. Not high priority roads you pay for access to. Just like fully government funded buses and the like don't care if you have a ticket or not. Whereas those that are only subsidized tend to still require a pass/ticket/payment. Also I'll just point out: Your car has a license plate. It is trivial to read those with an overhead camera. And, depending on the road/day, you can bet a cop will gladly run you down if they spot you have no license plate or decide they care about the polarized screen you put on top of it. At which point you can bet they'll want to see your ID and won't take "I am a sovereign citizen and this is a public road" as an answer. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains And you need to tie your body to your ticket when you get on a train. We tend to not care anywhere near as much about security with trains (because everyone knows bombs and box cutters only work if you are at least 100 feet above the ground!), but you can be damned sure the ticket machine where you inserted your cash took a picture of your face to go with it. I genuinely don't care about what kind of libertarian nonsense you are on about hating the concept of IDs at all. My point was simply that if you think the RealID requirement has ANY bearing on The Man knowing where you are and where you are going then... you don't actually understand what your exposure is. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 6 points 8 months ago (1 child) And the VIP lane on the highway is a private road? Whats next, HOV Lane brought to you by Carl's Jr.? Stop normalizing the surveillance state. It's not a good look. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (1 child) I mean... HOV lanes very often take photos at certain points to see if you have multiple passengers. And often those ARE the ones where individuals/duos can pay for access. It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is. If it makes you feel better? Ignore the surveillance tech that is already there. But don't get pissy if others don't live in the same blissful ignorance. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] flandish@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago i should have clarified: “access” meant physical meatspace access not allowance. permalink fedilink source parent [–] NaibofTabr@infosec.pub 4 points 8 months ago (1 child) I suspect this is what the payment requirement is really about. Like, yes they're getting money, but they're also getting a credit card transaction at the gate at the date and time of travel. It's always possible that someone else purchased your travel ticket for you (for instance I sometimes travel for work which my employer's travel agency books for me). But if you have to pay at the moment when your ID would be checked, presumably that has to be your personal card that you have on you in the moment. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago My understanding is that most airlines will still allow you to pay, in cash, at the customer service desk in the baggage area the day of. But they still require ID and you can be DAMNED sure that about forty different flags went off in a database if you do that. But yeah. Credit cards are immensely useful. They also go a LONG way towards providing very trackable behaviors for people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Bronzebeard@lemmy.zip 2 points 8 months ago Plenty of people are flying on tickets purchased by a corporation. permalink fedilink source parent [–] DempstersBox@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago have you ever heard of this neat concept, called freedom? permalink fedilink source parent [–] TheReturnOfPEB@reddthat.com 7 points 8 months ago surely not everyone ... permalink fedilink source parent [–] shplane@lemmy.world 2 points 8 months ago (1 child) A meme of jd vance is the most dangerous weapon of all permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Blackfeathr@lemmy.world 3 points 8 months ago Oh shit I'm cooked permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NaibofTabr@infosec.pub 48 points 8 months ago (2 children) but how else will we track where everyone is all the time permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 15 points 8 months ago* (4 children) Unless you are using a fake ID and fake credit card then they already have that data? They know John Smith who lives at 123 Main Street in Bumbfuck, WI and who paid with credit card 1234567890123456 is flying from MSN to LAX on December 1st, 2025 and returning via the same route on December 3rd, 2025. The RealID requirements are to, theoretically, streamline the process of matching person to face with more standardized ID requirements. Like all ID related legislature there is good and bad there. But if your focus is on The Man tracking you? This changes nothing unless you are already actively committing fraud at MANY levels. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] flandish@lemmy.world 19 points 8 months ago (1 child) neat. there is no reason they even need an id. do you need one to gain access to the highways? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -4 points 8 months ago* (1 child) Most highways are publicly accessible (and still log you with a Flock(TM) camera anyway...). But if you want to use the priority lane in states like Colorado? Yeah, they need to scan your pass and they very much do. The ID still matches the face/body to the Person. Its no different than checking if you are the person with a reservation at a hotel. That said, you can bet there is work in place to not actually need it through a mix of facial ID and profiling. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] flandish@lemmy.world 13 points 8 months ago (1 child) that’s my point. outside of a thin lane or three, which is probably considerable “private” - public infra should be accessible. Last I checked (abt six months ago) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. it’s all just a cash grab and control theater / normalization at airports. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains, except of course: profit. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. Because those are public roads. Not high priority roads you pay for access to. Just like fully government funded buses and the like don't care if you have a ticket or not. Whereas those that are only subsidized tend to still require a pass/ticket/payment. Also I'll just point out: Your car has a license plate. It is trivial to read those with an overhead camera. And, depending on the road/day, you can bet a cop will gladly run you down if they spot you have no license plate or decide they care about the polarized screen you put on top of it. At which point you can bet they'll want to see your ID and won't take "I am a sovereign citizen and this is a public road" as an answer. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains And you need to tie your body to your ticket when you get on a train. We tend to not care anywhere near as much about security with trains (because everyone knows bombs and box cutters only work if you are at least 100 feet above the ground!), but you can be damned sure the ticket machine where you inserted your cash took a picture of your face to go with it. I genuinely don't care about what kind of libertarian nonsense you are on about hating the concept of IDs at all. My point was simply that if you think the RealID requirement has ANY bearing on The Man knowing where you are and where you are going then... you don't actually understand what your exposure is. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 6 points 8 months ago (1 child) And the VIP lane on the highway is a private road? Whats next, HOV Lane brought to you by Carl's Jr.? Stop normalizing the surveillance state. It's not a good look. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (1 child) I mean... HOV lanes very often take photos at certain points to see if you have multiple passengers. And often those ARE the ones where individuals/duos can pay for access. It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is. If it makes you feel better? Ignore the surveillance tech that is already there. But don't get pissy if others don't live in the same blissful ignorance. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] flandish@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago i should have clarified: “access” meant physical meatspace access not allowance. permalink fedilink source parent [–] NaibofTabr@infosec.pub 4 points 8 months ago (1 child) I suspect this is what the payment requirement is really about. Like, yes they're getting money, but they're also getting a credit card transaction at the gate at the date and time of travel. It's always possible that someone else purchased your travel ticket for you (for instance I sometimes travel for work which my employer's travel agency books for me). But if you have to pay at the moment when your ID would be checked, presumably that has to be your personal card that you have on you in the moment. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago My understanding is that most airlines will still allow you to pay, in cash, at the customer service desk in the baggage area the day of. But they still require ID and you can be DAMNED sure that about forty different flags went off in a database if you do that. But yeah. Credit cards are immensely useful. They also go a LONG way towards providing very trackable behaviors for people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Bronzebeard@lemmy.zip 2 points 8 months ago Plenty of people are flying on tickets purchased by a corporation. permalink fedilink source parent [–] DempstersBox@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago have you ever heard of this neat concept, called freedom? permalink fedilink source parent [–] TheReturnOfPEB@reddthat.com 7 points 8 months ago surely not everyone ... permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 15 points 8 months ago* (4 children) Unless you are using a fake ID and fake credit card then they already have that data? They know John Smith who lives at 123 Main Street in Bumbfuck, WI and who paid with credit card 1234567890123456 is flying from MSN to LAX on December 1st, 2025 and returning via the same route on December 3rd, 2025. The RealID requirements are to, theoretically, streamline the process of matching person to face with more standardized ID requirements. Like all ID related legislature there is good and bad there. But if your focus is on The Man tracking you? This changes nothing unless you are already actively committing fraud at MANY levels. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] flandish@lemmy.world 19 points 8 months ago (1 child) neat. there is no reason they even need an id. do you need one to gain access to the highways? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -4 points 8 months ago* (1 child) Most highways are publicly accessible (and still log you with a Flock(TM) camera anyway...). But if you want to use the priority lane in states like Colorado? Yeah, they need to scan your pass and they very much do. The ID still matches the face/body to the Person. Its no different than checking if you are the person with a reservation at a hotel. That said, you can bet there is work in place to not actually need it through a mix of facial ID and profiling. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] flandish@lemmy.world 13 points 8 months ago (1 child) that’s my point. outside of a thin lane or three, which is probably considerable “private” - public infra should be accessible. Last I checked (abt six months ago) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. it’s all just a cash grab and control theater / normalization at airports. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains, except of course: profit. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. Because those are public roads. Not high priority roads you pay for access to. Just like fully government funded buses and the like don't care if you have a ticket or not. Whereas those that are only subsidized tend to still require a pass/ticket/payment. Also I'll just point out: Your car has a license plate. It is trivial to read those with an overhead camera. And, depending on the road/day, you can bet a cop will gladly run you down if they spot you have no license plate or decide they care about the polarized screen you put on top of it. At which point you can bet they'll want to see your ID and won't take "I am a sovereign citizen and this is a public road" as an answer. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains And you need to tie your body to your ticket when you get on a train. We tend to not care anywhere near as much about security with trains (because everyone knows bombs and box cutters only work if you are at least 100 feet above the ground!), but you can be damned sure the ticket machine where you inserted your cash took a picture of your face to go with it. I genuinely don't care about what kind of libertarian nonsense you are on about hating the concept of IDs at all. My point was simply that if you think the RealID requirement has ANY bearing on The Man knowing where you are and where you are going then... you don't actually understand what your exposure is. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 6 points 8 months ago (1 child) And the VIP lane on the highway is a private road? Whats next, HOV Lane brought to you by Carl's Jr.? Stop normalizing the surveillance state. It's not a good look. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (1 child) I mean... HOV lanes very often take photos at certain points to see if you have multiple passengers. And often those ARE the ones where individuals/duos can pay for access. It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is. If it makes you feel better? Ignore the surveillance tech that is already there. But don't get pissy if others don't live in the same blissful ignorance. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] flandish@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago i should have clarified: “access” meant physical meatspace access not allowance. permalink fedilink source parent [–] NaibofTabr@infosec.pub 4 points 8 months ago (1 child) I suspect this is what the payment requirement is really about. Like, yes they're getting money, but they're also getting a credit card transaction at the gate at the date and time of travel. It's always possible that someone else purchased your travel ticket for you (for instance I sometimes travel for work which my employer's travel agency books for me). But if you have to pay at the moment when your ID would be checked, presumably that has to be your personal card that you have on you in the moment. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago My understanding is that most airlines will still allow you to pay, in cash, at the customer service desk in the baggage area the day of. But they still require ID and you can be DAMNED sure that about forty different flags went off in a database if you do that. But yeah. Credit cards are immensely useful. They also go a LONG way towards providing very trackable behaviors for people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Bronzebeard@lemmy.zip 2 points 8 months ago Plenty of people are flying on tickets purchased by a corporation. permalink fedilink source parent [–] DempstersBox@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago have you ever heard of this neat concept, called freedom? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] flandish@lemmy.world 19 points 8 months ago (1 child) neat. there is no reason they even need an id. do you need one to gain access to the highways? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -4 points 8 months ago* (1 child) Most highways are publicly accessible (and still log you with a Flock(TM) camera anyway...). But if you want to use the priority lane in states like Colorado? Yeah, they need to scan your pass and they very much do. The ID still matches the face/body to the Person. Its no different than checking if you are the person with a reservation at a hotel. That said, you can bet there is work in place to not actually need it through a mix of facial ID and profiling. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] flandish@lemmy.world 13 points 8 months ago (1 child) that’s my point. outside of a thin lane or three, which is probably considerable “private” - public infra should be accessible. Last I checked (abt six months ago) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. it’s all just a cash grab and control theater / normalization at airports. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains, except of course: profit. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. Because those are public roads. Not high priority roads you pay for access to. Just like fully government funded buses and the like don't care if you have a ticket or not. Whereas those that are only subsidized tend to still require a pass/ticket/payment. Also I'll just point out: Your car has a license plate. It is trivial to read those with an overhead camera. And, depending on the road/day, you can bet a cop will gladly run you down if they spot you have no license plate or decide they care about the polarized screen you put on top of it. At which point you can bet they'll want to see your ID and won't take "I am a sovereign citizen and this is a public road" as an answer. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains And you need to tie your body to your ticket when you get on a train. We tend to not care anywhere near as much about security with trains (because everyone knows bombs and box cutters only work if you are at least 100 feet above the ground!), but you can be damned sure the ticket machine where you inserted your cash took a picture of your face to go with it. I genuinely don't care about what kind of libertarian nonsense you are on about hating the concept of IDs at all. My point was simply that if you think the RealID requirement has ANY bearing on The Man knowing where you are and where you are going then... you don't actually understand what your exposure is. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 6 points 8 months ago (1 child) And the VIP lane on the highway is a private road? Whats next, HOV Lane brought to you by Carl's Jr.? Stop normalizing the surveillance state. It's not a good look. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (1 child) I mean... HOV lanes very often take photos at certain points to see if you have multiple passengers. And often those ARE the ones where individuals/duos can pay for access. It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is. If it makes you feel better? Ignore the surveillance tech that is already there. But don't get pissy if others don't live in the same blissful ignorance. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] flandish@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago i should have clarified: “access” meant physical meatspace access not allowance. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -4 points 8 months ago* (1 child) Most highways are publicly accessible (and still log you with a Flock(TM) camera anyway...). But if you want to use the priority lane in states like Colorado? Yeah, they need to scan your pass and they very much do. The ID still matches the face/body to the Person. Its no different than checking if you are the person with a reservation at a hotel. That said, you can bet there is work in place to not actually need it through a mix of facial ID and profiling. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] flandish@lemmy.world 13 points 8 months ago (1 child) that’s my point. outside of a thin lane or three, which is probably considerable “private” - public infra should be accessible. Last I checked (abt six months ago) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. it’s all just a cash grab and control theater / normalization at airports. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains, except of course: profit. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. Because those are public roads. Not high priority roads you pay for access to. Just like fully government funded buses and the like don't care if you have a ticket or not. Whereas those that are only subsidized tend to still require a pass/ticket/payment. Also I'll just point out: Your car has a license plate. It is trivial to read those with an overhead camera. And, depending on the road/day, you can bet a cop will gladly run you down if they spot you have no license plate or decide they care about the polarized screen you put on top of it. At which point you can bet they'll want to see your ID and won't take "I am a sovereign citizen and this is a public road" as an answer. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains And you need to tie your body to your ticket when you get on a train. We tend to not care anywhere near as much about security with trains (because everyone knows bombs and box cutters only work if you are at least 100 feet above the ground!), but you can be damned sure the ticket machine where you inserted your cash took a picture of your face to go with it. I genuinely don't care about what kind of libertarian nonsense you are on about hating the concept of IDs at all. My point was simply that if you think the RealID requirement has ANY bearing on The Man knowing where you are and where you are going then... you don't actually understand what your exposure is. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 6 points 8 months ago (1 child) And the VIP lane on the highway is a private road? Whats next, HOV Lane brought to you by Carl's Jr.? Stop normalizing the surveillance state. It's not a good look. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (1 child) I mean... HOV lanes very often take photos at certain points to see if you have multiple passengers. And often those ARE the ones where individuals/duos can pay for access. It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is. If it makes you feel better? Ignore the surveillance tech that is already there. But don't get pissy if others don't live in the same blissful ignorance. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] flandish@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago i should have clarified: “access” meant physical meatspace access not allowance. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] flandish@lemmy.world 13 points 8 months ago (1 child) that’s my point. outside of a thin lane or three, which is probably considerable “private” - public infra should be accessible. Last I checked (abt six months ago) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. it’s all just a cash grab and control theater / normalization at airports. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains, except of course: profit. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. Because those are public roads. Not high priority roads you pay for access to. Just like fully government funded buses and the like don't care if you have a ticket or not. Whereas those that are only subsidized tend to still require a pass/ticket/payment. Also I'll just point out: Your car has a license plate. It is trivial to read those with an overhead camera. And, depending on the road/day, you can bet a cop will gladly run you down if they spot you have no license plate or decide they care about the polarized screen you put on top of it. At which point you can bet they'll want to see your ID and won't take "I am a sovereign citizen and this is a public road" as an answer. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains And you need to tie your body to your ticket when you get on a train. We tend to not care anywhere near as much about security with trains (because everyone knows bombs and box cutters only work if you are at least 100 feet above the ground!), but you can be damned sure the ticket machine where you inserted your cash took a picture of your face to go with it. I genuinely don't care about what kind of libertarian nonsense you are on about hating the concept of IDs at all. My point was simply that if you think the RealID requirement has ANY bearing on The Man knowing where you are and where you are going then... you don't actually understand what your exposure is. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 6 points 8 months ago (1 child) And the VIP lane on the highway is a private road? Whats next, HOV Lane brought to you by Carl's Jr.? Stop normalizing the surveillance state. It's not a good look. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (1 child) I mean... HOV lanes very often take photos at certain points to see if you have multiple passengers. And often those ARE the ones where individuals/duos can pay for access. It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is. If it makes you feel better? Ignore the surveillance tech that is already there. But don't get pissy if others don't live in the same blissful ignorance. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] flandish@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago i should have clarified: “access” meant physical meatspace access not allowance. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children) I did not need to show ID to hop on the brewster line into grand central. Because those are public roads. Not high priority roads you pay for access to. Just like fully government funded buses and the like don't care if you have a ticket or not. Whereas those that are only subsidized tend to still require a pass/ticket/payment. Also I'll just point out: Your car has a license plate. It is trivial to read those with an overhead camera. And, depending on the road/day, you can bet a cop will gladly run you down if they spot you have no license plate or decide they care about the polarized screen you put on top of it. At which point you can bet they'll want to see your ID and won't take "I am a sovereign citizen and this is a public road" as an answer. there is nothing special about flying compared to trains And you need to tie your body to your ticket when you get on a train. We tend to not care anywhere near as much about security with trains (because everyone knows bombs and box cutters only work if you are at least 100 feet above the ground!), but you can be damned sure the ticket machine where you inserted your cash took a picture of your face to go with it. I genuinely don't care about what kind of libertarian nonsense you are on about hating the concept of IDs at all. My point was simply that if you think the RealID requirement has ANY bearing on The Man knowing where you are and where you are going then... you don't actually understand what your exposure is. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 6 points 8 months ago (1 child) And the VIP lane on the highway is a private road? Whats next, HOV Lane brought to you by Carl's Jr.? Stop normalizing the surveillance state. It's not a good look. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (1 child) I mean... HOV lanes very often take photos at certain points to see if you have multiple passengers. And often those ARE the ones where individuals/duos can pay for access. It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is. If it makes you feel better? Ignore the surveillance tech that is already there. But don't get pissy if others don't live in the same blissful ignorance. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent [–] flandish@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago i should have clarified: “access” meant physical meatspace access not allowance. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 6 points 8 months ago (1 child) And the VIP lane on the highway is a private road? Whats next, HOV Lane brought to you by Carl's Jr.? Stop normalizing the surveillance state. It's not a good look. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (1 child) I mean... HOV lanes very often take photos at certain points to see if you have multiple passengers. And often those ARE the ones where individuals/duos can pay for access. It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is. If it makes you feel better? Ignore the surveillance tech that is already there. But don't get pissy if others don't live in the same blissful ignorance. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip -1 points 8 months ago* (1 child) I mean... HOV lanes very often take photos at certain points to see if you have multiple passengers. And often those ARE the ones where individuals/duos can pay for access. It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is. If it makes you feel better? Ignore the surveillance tech that is already there. But don't get pissy if others don't live in the same blissful ignorance. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago* It isn't "normalizing" to acknowledge what reality is Ahh, but what if reality isn't normal? Name another point in human history where our identities, our habits, our routine, our very movement within our states borders...was a fucking commodity, with chunks owned by the government and curated by the richest people in the world. I'll wait. And don't say the slave trade because that's just admitting that we aren't free people. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] flandish@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago i should have clarified: “access” meant physical meatspace access not allowance. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NaibofTabr@infosec.pub 4 points 8 months ago (1 child) I suspect this is what the payment requirement is really about. Like, yes they're getting money, but they're also getting a credit card transaction at the gate at the date and time of travel. It's always possible that someone else purchased your travel ticket for you (for instance I sometimes travel for work which my employer's travel agency books for me). But if you have to pay at the moment when your ID would be checked, presumably that has to be your personal card that you have on you in the moment. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago My understanding is that most airlines will still allow you to pay, in cash, at the customer service desk in the baggage area the day of. But they still require ID and you can be DAMNED sure that about forty different flags went off in a database if you do that. But yeah. Credit cards are immensely useful. They also go a LONG way towards providing very trackable behaviors for people. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 4 points 8 months ago My understanding is that most airlines will still allow you to pay, in cash, at the customer service desk in the baggage area the day of. But they still require ID and you can be DAMNED sure that about forty different flags went off in a database if you do that. But yeah. Credit cards are immensely useful. They also go a LONG way towards providing very trackable behaviors for people. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Bronzebeard@lemmy.zip 2 points 8 months ago Plenty of people are flying on tickets purchased by a corporation. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DempstersBox@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago have you ever heard of this neat concept, called freedom? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] TheReturnOfPEB@reddthat.com 7 points 8 months ago surely not everyone ... permalink fedilink source parent
[–] shplane@lemmy.world 2 points 8 months ago (1 child) A meme of jd vance is the most dangerous weapon of all permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Blackfeathr@lemmy.world 3 points 8 months ago Oh shit I'm cooked permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Blackfeathr@lemmy.world 3 points 8 months ago Oh shit I'm cooked permalink fedilink source parent